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  • Doctor Who

    I'm not sure where to place this now the DW subforum is gone, so I made a new thread for the series. I hope this is okay.


    Originally posted by Guardian.co.uk
    Doctor Who is now immortal, reveals the BBCEdict that Time Lords can regenerate only 12 times before they die has been quietly ditched

    He travels through time and space, saves the Earth, and has millions of fans all over the world. But as every "Whovian" knows, the Doctor cannot last for ever: Time Lords are able to regenerate only 12 times before they die.

    Fans have always thought that the 13th doctor would be the last, thanks to a 1976 Doctor Who episode, The Deadly Assassin, featuring Tom Baker as the Doctor in his fourth incarnation, and revealing for the first time the regeneration limit. But a passing comment in a children's television programme later this month is set to rewrite history and cast the Doctor, iconic hero of the world's most successful and longest-running science fiction series, as immortal.

    The moment comes in the CBBC spin-off show, The Sarah Jane Adventures, which stars former companion Elisabeth Sladen as Sarah Jane Smith. Matt Smith, who plays the current Doctor Who, guest stars in a two-part episode called The Death of the Doctor, to be screened on October 25 and 26. While the Doctor and Clyde Langer, played by Daniel Anthony, are in the process of outwitting spooky vulture undertakers the Shansheeth, Clyde asks how many times he can regenerate. The Doctor indicates that there is no limit. The action continues.

    Fans of the show have been expecting an official moving of the goalposts for some time, but it was anticipated as part of the Christmas special, rather than in an after-school slot on the CBBC channel.

    Back in 1976, 12 regenerations must have felt like a safely distant number to pluck from the ether. Now, however, with Smith playing the character in his 11th incarnation, circumventing the rule has begun to feel rather urgent. As JK Rowling hinted last week, once a hero has conquered the world, it is hard to put him away for good: we may also see an extension to the seven-book Harry Potter franchise, despite its very final ending and Nineteen Years Later epilogue.

    And with the Doctor Who brand constantly expanding (including spin-offs that range from lunchboxes to the Doctor Who Live show currently on a 25-date, nine-city tour) it was hardly likely that the BBC was going to call time on the series.

    It was a stroke of PR genius to slip the hotly anticipated fudging of the Doctor's longevity into a children's series: the episodes are now sure to draw in the viewers. However, Whovians (famously likened by Sarah Jane creator Russell T Davies to a swarm of mosquitoes) will be disappointed that there is no technical reason given for the change: it is simply stated in passing.

    Whovian Simon says: "Many of us old-timers have looked forward to the story that addresses the end of the Doctor's life span. I'm gutted that it appears that something so integral to the show's long-term storyline has been passed over in this way."

    The BBC would not say whether there would be any further explanation. "We never comment on future storylines for Doctor Who," said a spokeswoman.
    I guess it was expected, the show is too important for the BBC. And I don't really care, I'm a junk... I want more. But I understand that the people who always followed DW feel a bit punk'd.

  • #2
    To be honest I always thought it was going to get done like this, in a small way, lacking in splainy. Having a big ep focussed on it would probably just give rise to more fandom splits, technical trivialites and all out arguements than it would be worth. Deal with it quietly and move on.
    JUST ENOUGH KILL

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    • #3
      Surely the Doctor could've been lying either in the Tom Baker era, or now? So, the truth is kind of a blurry thing here and I think they can get away with fudging. The Doctor lies, everybody lies... and since he's the last of the Time Lords, we only have his word for it.

      Of course, 11 could've been lying to spare the kiddies...but I'm assuming not, given that I don't think they're wanting to kill him off any time soon!

      Can I just say how much I'm missing Who at the moment? Rewatched some 9 episodes... CE was grand. Still not sure if I prefer him or 11. Hmm...well, hurry up and make some more 11 eps so I can make my decision, eh, BBC?

      Not til Christmas you say?

      Bstards! What do I pay my licence fee for grumble grumble (though, Spooks is still there to be enjoyed, phew)


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      • #4
        On another board somebody suggested that the maximum of 12 regenerations was not something biological, but more something like a rule the timelords made to control the amount of timelords. And because the timelords are not longer there to control the regenerations of the doctor, he will live forever.

        But I know too little of DW and timelords to know if this makes sense.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Nina View Post
          On another board somebody suggested that the maximum of 12 regenerations was not something biological, but more something like a rule the timelords made to control the amount of timelords. And because the timelords are not longer there to control the regenerations of the doctor, he will live forever.

          But I know too little of DW and timelords to know if this makes sense.
          I heard this too. Personally and I know that I am going to get boohood for this but I would have liked it if they had stopped at the ampount of 13 Doctors. I love DW and I am really new to it so of course there is a part of me that would love it to go on and on until forever but in my experinece shows reach a point after wich it is just not thesame for me anymore. ( I believe this is called jumping the shark?) I personaly would love DW to end at a really high note rather then have it die a slow and painfull death.

          And I can understand the longtime fans who feel a bit dissapointed by this news and the way it was handled. I miss DW ( on a completaly non topic related note..)
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          • #6
            And more DW news:

            Originally posted by IO9.com & gallifreynewsbase.blogspot.com
            The inevitable (and awesome) has finally happened: Mark Sheppard, the man behind Badger/Romo Lampkin/Benedict Valda/Crowley/Manservant Neville/every other shifty but strangely lovable science fiction character of the last decade is playing a "huge role" on the next series of Doctor Who.

            Apparently having run out of genre shows to appear on in the United States, Sheppard is finally appearing on a show in his native Britain. The news comes from a ValleyCon press release explaining why he had to cancel his appearance there:

            "We had just booked Mark's airline tickets a week ago when less than 12 hours later he got the dream job of any kid who grew up in England-and many kids here too. He landed a huge role in the new Dr. Who but they needed him there the next day."

            Here's hoping he really did land a "huge" role - since he's based in Los Angeles, I'm guessing the series wouldn't bring him in unless they had something big in mind. In any event, you can officially add Doctor Who to Sheppard's genre credits, which already include (very deep breath) Firefly, Medium, Bionic Woman, 24, The Middleman, Burn Notice, Battlestar Galactica, Dollhouse, Chuck, Warehouse 13, Supernatural, and LEVERAGE not to mention early appearances on The X-Files, Sliders, and Star Trek: Voyager.

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            • #7
              Lol good idea to start this thread! The regeneration news was interesting, and I *just* heard about Mark Sheppard and was going to post it here! I'm SO excited, loved him as Badger, LOVE him as Crowley, and I'm looking forward to seeing what he does on Who...any ideas on who he'll play? I'm wondering if he'll be some shifty criminal associate of Miss Prison Inmate Song, but you never know....it doesn't really matter who he plays, as long as he talks a lot in his usual accent!

              It is so funny though to get this announcement now, when just last weekend at Chicago Con he was saying how much he'd love to be on DW! Sneaky bastard must have already known then about this....

              Originally posted by Wolfie Gilmore View Post
              Can I just say how much I'm missing Who at the moment? Rewatched some 9 episodes... CE was grand. Still not sure if I prefer him or 11. Hmm...well, hurry up and make some more 11 eps so I can make my decision, eh, BBC?
              Hee, well I'm glad that now you at least have 9 in the running for favorite of NuWho!

              And I so agree about missing Who...and my hiatus has been at least a few months shorter so far!
              Promise that you'll return to me.

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              • #8
                In the meantime, I'm catching up on a lot of Hartnell, Troughton and Pertwee. So far my favorite Classic Who episode is the epic Troughton regeneration story 10-parter, The War Games. Lovely, lovely Jamie (he was a little kilt-wearing flirt--particularly with Victoria and even Peri--I would love to see Frazer Hines come back for an appearance). And I also have a thing for old Ian, who seemed to carry all the weight. The '60s male companions were a lot more useful than the ones that followed because they started becoming useless when the Doctor was young enough to do all the running around. I've sampled all the Doctors. So far I've really taken to Troughton and Pertwee. Least favorite is definitely C. Baker. Tennant is by far my number one with Smith easily in second place. Eccleston is pretty far down my list, honestly.

                I've noticed that Smith's era is homaging Troughton and Pertwee a lot (he's on record as really loving Troughton's Tomb of the Cybermen--it's the reason he wanted the bow-tie look--and as for Pertwee, there were the Silurians, stealing clothes that weren't from the TARDIS, singing in the shower, singing La donna รจ mobile and now Jo), whereas Tennant probably homaged T. Baker and Davison the most (which he clearly grew up watching, not to mention his close friendship now with Davison--and Georgia, of course--T. Baker's zany, manic portrayal + Davison's dramatic side are the most obvious elements--though the focus on how Four left Sarah Jane behind--the acting with big-eyed expressions also has been noted--and it's also been pointed out how the glasses, stripes and trainers are all reminiscent of Davison--in Time Crash, of course). Eccleston's less-friendly Doctor probably reminds me of Hartnell the most (both thaw out, but they're a bit cold, untrusting and rude early on before becoming kinder towards the very end, allowing their next incarnations to be much warmer)--and perhaps the action-man side of Pertwee. Troughton/Two strikes me as being one of the most companion-friendly Doctors. Ten's regeneration sequence had the most in common with Two's (who probably took his regeneration the worst of all and was one where the Doctor tried to delay, run away and avoid the inevitable in an incident that involved the Time Lords) and Five's (the pained struggle into the TARDIS after a radiation dose and dying to save a companion).

                I'd probably rank them like this:
                1. David Tennant
                2. Matt Smith
                3. Patrick Troughton
                4. Jon Pertwee
                5. Tom Baker
                6. Peter Davison
                7. Christopher Eccleston
                8. William Hartnell
                9. Sylvester McCoy
                10. Paul McGann
                11. Colin Baker

                Favorite companions are probably:
                1. Rose Marion Tyler
                2. Donna Noble
                3. James Robert "Jamie" McCrimmon
                4. Ian Chesterton
                5. Amelia "Amy" Jessica Pond
                6. Rory Williams
                7. Sarah Jane Smith
                8. Brigadier Alistair Gordon Lethbridge-Stewart
                9. Zoe Heriot
                10. Barbara Wright
                11. Josephine "Jo" Grant
                12. Captain Jack Harkness
                13. Susan Foreman
                14. Dorothy "Ace" McShane
                15. Romana II

                At least there's something for me to watch! Oh, and I follow Torchwood--well, I like Owen, despite the first series being terrible and not picking up until halfway through the second and the Children of Earth really being where it lived up to itself--and The Sarah Jane Adventures--I know it's a kid's show, but it's really not bad, is an integral part of the multiverse and it doesn't talk down--too, just for the sake of filling up the calendar and wanting to get all the little multiverse nuggets.

                Anyway...

                A few more hours until the next SJA! ...Which, admittedly, being an American I shouldn't be watching everything so soon after transmission. LOL.

                Speaking of America, it's pretty neat that they're coming here to film in Utah (one thing I do enjoy is seeing all the international filming that they do--Croatia was really well-used last series). This last season they certainly stepped up their efforts to bring the show stateside (as can be seen in the 5x13 Confidential). David, John, etc... came to the 2009 Comic Con, so they're all definitely trying to find an audience here. It would be nice if BBC America would stop butchering the 50+ minute episodes and 1 hour+ specials--it makes me shudder when I notice that my apparently expendable favorite scenes have been cut out. And those DVD prices really need to plummet down to a normal level. I really can't purchase until they do.

                SJA, then Christmas, then 7 DW, then the TW 10-parter (with our very own Jane Espenson), then 6 more DW, then another SJA, then Christmas again. Next year will really be packed (like 2008 was).

                As far as the Aussie K-9 kids series goes... Yeah, I'm really hoping it will be put out of its misery so Sarah Jane can have her K-9 Mark IV back.

                And I'm thrilled about the upcoming Death of the Doctor with Matt Smith and Katy Manning (Jo Grant) appearing! I've heard a lot of companions also get name-checked, including Ian and Barbara being a couple!

                As far as the regeneration issue that's coming up in DotD, I've also heard it argued that the Master has been given a new set of regenerations by the Time Lords before and was resurrected again during the Time War (he's already well-past 13 regenerations--he was even stealing bodies after using up all of his lives for a while--Anthony Ainley and Eric Roberts--before the Time Lords stuck him in presumably the Derek Jacobi form--who then became John Simm), so it's very possible that the Time Lords were given many, many regeneration cycles while they were getting resurrected over and over again during the Time War (both Rassilon and the Master were dead and resurrected). So, it's very possible that that's when the Doctor's regeneration limit went out of the window. Not to mention the Time Lords are no longer around to enforce any limits or berate him for being too hands-on (hence what caused Two to be forced to regenerate and why Three was exiled to Earth and UNIT with a non-functioning TARDIS for a long time). It's probably the Time War that caused the regeneration limit to be turned off. Rassilon's whole thing was knowing the secret to immortality.

                If anybody wants to join me, I've been hanging out at http://gallifreybase.com/forum/index.php? lately.
                Last edited by NileQT87; 19-10-10, 05:35 PM.

                "If there is no great glorious end to all this, if nothing we do matters, then all that matters is what we do."
                "Nothing in the world is the way it ought to be. It's harsh and cruel. But that's why there's us. Champions."

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                • #9
                  Not only has Mark Sheppard officially been cast in a role next season, but there are already photos too!

                  (Kind of spoilery)
                  Spoiler:


                  Source (In which there's a video clip of filming as well)

                  Lol, shooting River Song and wearing that badass suit? Love him even more...

                  And apparently his name will be Canton Everett Delaware III, lol.
                  Promise that you'll return to me.

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                  • #10
                    Why do his characters always look the same? Or at least the ones I did saw in other series.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Nina View Post
                      Why do his characters always look the same? Or at least the ones I did saw in other series.
                      Lol, maybe he just REALLY likes dressing in snazzy black suits?

                      I am annoyed though to learn that he might be using an American accent for this role (it fits with his name and where the epp takes place I think, and I think during the clip of filming his voice sounded like it), I was so looking forward to that lovely sexy voice of his, and it seems such a waste to make him American!
                      Promise that you'll return to me.

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                      • #12
                        The Sun claims that Smith wants a parrot...

                        Dr Who's a pretty boy then?

                        DOCTOR Who is looking for a new companion - a PARROT.

                        Actor Matt Smith has revealed he wants to get himself a comedy shoulder prop - just like his hero Peter Sellers did in a Pink Panther movie sketch about pirates.

                        It is one of a number of tweaks Matt is hoping to make to his Timelord outfit for the second series. He said: "I think with this Doctor, you never know what he's going to do or say, or what he's going to turn up in in the morning. He could have a flamingo on his shoulder.

                        "Have you ever seen the Pink Panther where Peter Sellers has the parrot on his shoulder?

                        "I'd love to get some sort of pretend parrot on my shoulder because Peter Sellers is my hero. I'm working on it."

                        He is also after some extra layers of clothing, as his tweed jacket ensemble is letting the cold in during filming. Matt said: "I know I want a coat. You get cold in only a tweed jacket.

                        "And I want a hat. Not all the time. Just now and again. If feels Doctory and right for my Doctor. I think it can evolve and give it that variety."

                        He will soon need his warm clobber - for filming in the US.

                        He and Karen Gillan, who plays Amy Pond, jet out to Utah and Arizona next month to film a special show. Temperatures there drop to freezing at night.
                        Now that I have this idea in my head...I wants it! I mean, I wouldn't want it to start a craze that leads to neglected/mistreated parrots, but...gah! I can see 11 immediately bonding with it, and talking to it all the time, and then imagine Rory and Amy's reactions to it, lol, the looks they'd give the pair of them... Ah well....a fake one would be funny too!

                        And I think he wants the fez back....I'd be down with that as well! As for the cold, perhaps they could give him a thick v-neck sweater to wear underneath the tweed jacket? I feel like that'd go better with the outfit, the jacket seems like it's supposed to be his version of 10's trench coat and 9's leather jacket, can't go putting on another jacket OVER that one, IMO...
                        Promise that you'll return to me.

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                        • #13
                          I agree that Smith needs something to jazz up his Doctor Who...but a PARROT?!! I'm not envisioning this. MAYBE a flamingo, they're cool.

                          And I say no to the fez! All I can think when he wears it is the monkey in Aladdin. And now with parrot is he trying to graduate to Jafar? I'm sorry to be so snarky here, but I find this request for a parrot comical.

                          Thank you for the article! I'm glad he's thinking about some flair and costume changes. I thought his outfit was a little bland and brown last season. :/

                          Lydia made the punch!

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Ehlwyen View Post
                            I agree that Smith needs something to jazz up his Doctor Who...but a PARROT?!! I'm not envisioning this. MAYBE a flamingo, they're cool.
                            Um, PARROTS ARE COOL TOO, okay?!

                            And I say no to the fez! All I can think when he wears it is the monkey in Aladdin. And now with parrot is he trying to graduate to Jafar? I'm sorry to be so snarky here, but I find this request for a parrot comical.
                            But fezzes are cool now...

                            Thank you for the article! I'm glad he's thinking about some flair and costume changes. I thought his outfit was a little bland and brown last season. :/
                            Heh, well admittedly brown wasn't an issue I had (I mean, 10's outfit was pretty much all brown as well, except for the blue suit, but I preferred the brown suit anyway...)... But yeah IDK....I think if I were to add something to 11's outfit, it'd be smartical glasses--yes, I know, probably too much like 10 and all that, but...I think if they were slightly different, they could play into the whole "math teacher" look, and be more of a carryover personality trait thing (it was originally from 5 no?), and we know from those early pictures that Smith can pull off smartical glasses well! (And maybe I'm still having trouble letting go of them, lol...)
                            Promise that you'll return to me.

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                            • #15
                              I really doubt a parrot will happen to be fair. Mr Smith's tongue was probably well and truly in cheek when he said that (a parrot version of K-9 though? hmmmm.

                              I think the fez is a distinct possibility as MS had some difficulty letting it go apparently. As for the coat issue, well as long as it's not too long and flowing then I'd be game. I could see fur.
                              JUST ENOUGH KILL

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