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Joss Sci-Fi Drama The Nevers Ordered at HBO.

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  • Priceless
    replied
    Wow Mary Sue, that was brutal 'There have to be other writers out there who aren’t toxic or dated who could’ve written a Victorian superpower show'.

    The characters do sound highly derivative of previous Whedon characters, but that's what a lot of writers do. They have one question or one story and keep going over and over it in different ways, and there's nothing wrong in that.

    To answer some of the criticisms, Amalia True may be a new Buffy, but I love Buffy with all her emotional damage, so that doesn't put me off the character at all and I am very open to liking her as much as I like Buffy. Show me a main character in a tv show that doesn't go through emotional trauma - that's what main characters are for and how dull a drama would be without any . . . err . . . drama And of course drama leaves trauma, which is only to be expected in an episodic tv show.

    They describe Amy Manson’s Maladie as an evil River from Firefly, but to me she sounds more like a Dru character, except much less vampiric. The writer complains about this trope and how badly women are treated in Whedon shows, and how awful that is. So what does he want? More happy shiny shows were women never do anything and never suffer, how horribly unreal and saccharine would that be - then MarySue really would have something to complain about.

    Hugo Swan is obviously going to be the male lead and hero type, so I don't understand why MarySue has such a problem with how he's being described.

    Overall, this article has made me like the concept more than I originally did, because they've let their dislike of Whedon as a person get in the way of appreciating his work. They seem to suggest this show is going to be terrible because it's so like his other shows. Well, I liked his other shows, or at least I love Buffy and Angel, so if they're even vaguely like them, I'll like The Nevers.

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  • TriBel
    replied
    Originally posted by Priceless View Post
    I am hopeful that this description of the show and characters actually undersells it, because it doesn't fill me with excitement. The actors are all great, and I'm especially excited by Nick Frost's inclusion, but overall I'm not really sold yet.
    You're not on your own. Don't shoot me...I'm only the messenger.

    https://www.themarysue.com/joss-whed...e-nevers-cast/

    "We’re not necessarily big fans of Joss Whedon’s newest project, The Nevers. The HBO drama sounds like it’s Buffy the Vampire Slayer in Victorian England, but with all the worst elements of the series. The full cast list has finally been announced, along with their character descriptions, and yeah … it’s not particularly great.

    Take for example the lead character, Amalia True, who will be played by Laura Donnelly. She is described by Entertainment Weekly as being “the most reckless, impulsive, emotionally damaged hero of her time. A menace to stuffy Victorian society, she would die for the cause and kill for a drink.”

    We’re not necessarily big fans of Joss Whedon’s newest project, The Nevers. The HBO drama sounds like it’s Buffy the Vampire Slayer in Victorian England, but with all the worst elements of the series. The full cast list has finally been announced, along with their character descriptions, and yeah … it’s not particularly great.

    Take for example the lead character, Amalia True, who will be played by Laura Donnelly. She is described by Entertainment Weekly as being “the most reckless, impulsive, emotionally damaged hero of her time. A menace to stuffy Victorian society, she would die for the cause and kill for a drink.” There’s so much to unpack there, but let’s start with “emotionally damaged.” Must all of Whedon’s heroines be emotionally damaged?

    Buffy went through hell and back, and so did Cordelia, Willow, Echo, Inara, River, Zoe, and every other female character Whedon has ever written. The nature of storytelling means your characters will go through some trauma, but Whedon loves emotionally traumatizing his female heroes to a degree that he doesn’t traumatize his male heroes. There is also the element of sexual violence present in his narratives that often is used to torture his heroines. All in all, hyping up the protagonist as being emotionally damaged and impulsive is not the best look.

    Then let’s look at Amy Manson’s Maladie. “Committed by her husband (and genuinely unstable), she’s been warped by a power she can’t understand, and tortured by doctors intent on finding its source,” wrote Entertainment Weekly. “She now lives underground, runs a gang and is on an infamous murder spree. She affects a theatrical parody of a bedlam waif, but mad as she is, she’s a woman with a purpose.”

    I guess she’s like an evil River from Firefly? Whedon does like his tortured women who use violence ostensibly to defend themselves from the patriarchy and toxic men but who really are acting out a male power fantasy.

    Again, this is a trope that’s popular in Whedon’s works. He loves his damaged, partially insane women who are violent. They’re present in most of his work and it’s a deeply problematic trope.

    The male characters don’t have it any easier. Take Hugo Swann (James Norton) who’s a “pansexual posh boy whose charm has about five years left on its lease. He runs a secret club and a side trade in blackmail. He’s devoted to fulfilling everyone’s worst impression of him — and fascinated by the Touched.” Just think, even after Whedon managed to bury his gays in Buffy, he’s still finding a new way to be vaguely homophobic. Making a pansexual character a blackmailer and a cad is not necessarily a great look, particularly given Whedon’s obsession with heteronormativity.

    There are more characters to break down. Like Annie, the “career criminal” who happens to be the only Black woman in the cast, or Augustus, who is described as being a “sweet, disarming nerd” which is Whedon speak for “entitled nice guy.” There is so much here that reminds me of those memes where people have bots watch a bunch of Hallmark movies and then write one. It’s like a bot literally wrote these descriptions based on Whedon’s previous titles and didn’t bother to do much except change the names,

    There have to be other writers out there who aren’t toxic or dated who could’ve written a Victorian superpower show. Maybe there’s a writer of color or a woman who could have tackled the project. Instead, we’re getting leftovers from the Angel character line-up. I would like to be pleasantly surprised by the show, but given Whedon’s recent track record, I doubt I will be."

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  • Priceless
    replied
    Originally posted by GoSpuffy View Post

    I am hopeful that this description of the show and characters actually undersells it, because it doesn't fill me with excitement. The actors are all great, and I'm especially excited by Nick Frost's inclusion, but overall I'm not really sold yet.

    Leave a comment:


  • GoSpuffy
    replied
    The cast is announced
    https://www.tor.com/2019/07/31/joss-...ensemble-cast/

    Leave a comment:


  • Priceless
    replied
    The Nevers now has its own website

    https://www.hbothenevers.com/

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  • Priceless
    replied
    I am very excited to see what Joss has come up with. I'm also happy that Espenson and Petrie are working on it too.

    Leave a comment:


  • flow
    replied
    https://comicbook.com/tv-shows/2019/...egins-filming/

    flow

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  • Priceless
    replied
    They've started principal photography on The Nevers, and there is an up and coming podcast about the show, called The Nevers Podcast . . .

    Now feels like a good time to remind everyone of our podcast. It's less than two weeks away from reaching your ears! Principal photography (filming) has started on THE NEVERS and you may have some questions. So tweet them to us or email it to: theneverspodcast@gmail.com

    Leave a comment:


  • Willow from Buffy
    replied
    Man, hire her already. Joss, Jane and Marti would be the most McFly team since Buffy.

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  • Priceless
    replied
    Some tweets between Marti and Joss yesterday . . .

    @Joss
    Marti, MARTI, how many of my lives did your talented heart save? #JossProtector (I cried for two hours straight writing that speech. Never been happier. And it was the score to SHAWSHANK REDEMPTION, maybe just the last track on repeat, the whole time.)



    @martinoxon
    22h22 hours ago

    Yeh. We did like that. We both cried and wrote. Come to think of it, some things haven't changed much.

    Those days! Those incredible days that, when I take a moment, I remember so clearly. ❤️ you then, ❤️ you now across the sea making new heroines, I'm sure.



    @joss

    Replying to @martinoxon

    I think you’ll be pleased.

    10:01 AM - 15 May 2019

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  • Priceless
    replied
    https://deadline.com/2019/04/laura-d...rs-1202599997/

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  • TimeTravellingBunny
    replied
    Originally posted by Priceless View Post
    Me neither. But it was based on a series of books, so it was sort of hamstrung from the start. I'm hopeful that with so much freedom, the new Buffy will be better
    I really liked season 1, but season 2 was a big disappointment.
    I think you mean "hamstrung because it was based on a Charlaine Harris series of books", LOL..

    One of my favourite things about the show was Len and his backstory, and that was written for the show specifically, because apparently, Len is white in the books.

    Leave a comment:


  • Priceless
    replied
    Originally posted by Silver1 View Post
    See, I didn't think much of Midnight Texas at all.
    Me neither. But it was based on a series of books, so it was sort of hamstrung from the start. I'm hopeful that with so much freedom, the new Buffy will be better

    Leave a comment:


  • Silver1
    replied
    Whedon is currently helming “The Nevers” for HBO and has a female detective comedy series in the works at Freeform. He is also executive producing the “Buffy” reboot, which will be written by “Midnight, Texas” creator Monica Owusu-Breen.
    See, I didn't think much of Midnight Texas at all.

    Leave a comment:


  • HowiMetdaSlayer
    replied
    Sounding like 2020 at earliest...

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