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Reacting to Reactions! - BtVS Season 2

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  • Reacting to Reactions! - BtVS Season 2

    Okay so this is a thread specifically for any/all reaction vids to Buffy Season 2.

    I'm going to continue to follow alley box., failwhale34, Liam Duke and van. I'm still trying to catch up with alley box. and failwhale so I'll be going at a fair pace through this season if I can manage it, as they are hitting the end of S2/have just started S3 respectively. I'll post the links and odd comments as I head through the season and anyone is free and very welcome to join in watching/commenting on those too. But the thread is for any reactions to the season if anyone wants to add any particular ones they've enjoyed or the links for other reactors for the season they're following, whether current or old it really doesn't matter.

    So, with that being said, let's get into it... Yeet! ( to failwhale there ).

  • #2
    2.01 When She Was Bad

    alley box.
    I actually enjoy the time jumps as it just emphasises that the show is going to be about them growing up to pin it with the school years, particularly in the first few seasons. But I can understand preferring stories which don't have chunks where you don't actually see the events that happen between seasons. It can be done very well though, and actually result in emphasising even more the impact of something you saw by seeing how much they have/haven't moved on from it when you rejoin a little time after, and WSWB does that excellently.

    Interesting response to Willow/Xander, she seems fairly open to the possibility of them as a couple and I was pleased to feel like Xander was getting a more positive reception from her. A lot of appreciation for the character dynamics which is nice. After those initial comments made to her she still seems really self-conscious about what seems a clear liking of Bangel, it'll be interesting to see if this eases.


    failwhale34
    It wasn't surprising he was openly saying he wants to see the show pick up from S1 and he did seem much more energised by this and appreciated how it was building from what had happened in first season. It clearly hit a new level for him. I'm not great for noticing production aspects so it was interesting to hear he felt the budget increase was immediately apparent.

    Great to hear love for so many character moments and the potential to come. I expected he'd like the follow up from what happened at the end of last season and he did speak about that as a highlight and praised SMG's performance again.



    Liam Duke
    Really liking the Snyder appreciation and the love for the friendships. Again liking the bridge this gives from S1 which really flags an aspect of the show I love the most in how well they tie past experiences into the ongoing story. But if he's glad after one episode of angst that it didn't last forever, S6 might be tough for him. But then that's what it's exploring, so who knows.

    He feels very like I did about the possibility of Xander/Willow, although possibly a little more open to it. It was interesting that a couple of people commented on the Buffy/Xander dance scene going on a little too long. Personally I think it had to be uncomfortable for it to hit the notes it needed to in how much she was effectively lashing out. But I don't think that was my perspective when I first saw it.

    I do like Liam and he has interesting immediate thoughts, but he does ramble and repeat himself quite a bit.


    van
    There's a lot of love for Buffy and Angel here so I'm expecting her to really enjoy this season. The connection to the character moments was great and her jumpiness doesn't get any less amusing.

    --
    I don't tend to read the comments under the vids but did see a comment under Liam's that said it was DB in The Master's makeup in this episode. I don't think I've ever heard that before.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Stoney View Post
      [COLOR=#000000]I don't tend to read the comments under the vids but did see a comment under Liam's that said it was DB in The Master's makeup in this episode. I don't think I've ever heard that before.
      Yeah it was DB To be honest, you can tell it's not Marc Metcalf throughout the episode and particularly in the Giles dream sequence. His face looks slightly 'off.'

      I think the S1-S2 jump in production values and budget is immediately apparent even from the opening scene. The camera pans over the cemetery to show the scope of their location (locations = bigger budget) and the stunts and vampire dusting effect is noticeably better. And then in the first scenes at Sunnydale High we're suddenly treated to brand new hallways that we've never seen before, the common room, the stairway etc. These all become commonplace in S2-S3 but pay particular attention to S1 and none of these same hallways exist and they used to walk the same couple of halls over and over again. I'm 99% positive that in S1 they used the actual hallways of Torrance High School and hadn't built any sets for the corridors etc.

      The camera work is also far better (crane shots etc) and overall the production just feels 'bigger' (more extras, vampires, locations, sets etc). This is due to S1 being a very low budget midseason replacement series and then getting a major 'glow up' in S2 as the budget increased and it became a bonafide prime time show. They do the best they can in S1, and Prophecy Girl in particular is absolutely magnificent and gorgeously shot, but it is very apparent it's low budget.

      I like that Failwhale is aware of this stuff as it's a particular interest of mine as well. I totally enjoy analysing the show from a story and character perspective but I'm also very interested in the production side of things (it factors majorly into what seasons/episodes I like/dislike based) so it appeals to me he's aware of it. Alley also begins to comment a lot more frequently on camera angles and shows an appreciation for the cinematography which is awesome.

      ~ Banner by Nina ~

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      • #4
        I've always really enjoyed reading your thoughts on the changing stunt work too for encouraging me to consider an aspect of the show that can often pass me by, so I am really enjoying his comments on this kind of thing definitely. It's pretty early to know if this'll stay the same, but I think one of the reasons I'm really enjoying watching all four of these together is that they are quite different and whilst Liam I think tends to look at the show more analytically which of course I enjoy, alley box. reminds me more of what I was like when I first watched it more on a surface level but often reads things slightly differently which is interesting. And then failwhale looks at things I don't tend to notice. So it's a good mix.

        I had just put the way The Master looked odd in the Giles/Master dream sequence in WSWB to him being in a brightly lit/daytime scene and thought that the makeup just didn't work so well when it wasn't alongside the darker lighting. Finding out it wasn't even Marc Metcalf was really interesting.

        Comment


        • #5
          I tuned in tonight for alley box. I am not sure I can follow her through all seven seasons, though. I think she is a very nice and genuine person. I love her enthusiasm. But her editing is not only driving me nuts, but it also makes no sense to me. Is the show not interesting enough to just watch it? Do you have to keep zooming in and out and to tilt sideways to keep your audience focused? I also think a bit less gesturing and fewer Yesssss and Noooooos and Huhs and Hachs and Hos wouldn't hurt either. I am not against exclamations on principle it but it gets a bit too much.

          I'll try again for the next episode but it could be it's my last one. Maybe I should give failwhale a chance instead? I will definitely not be able to follow two or even three reactors and I have already arrived at season seven with Liam, but one more reactor could be something I could manage to watch.

          flow
          Last edited by flow; 11-08-20, 11:30 PM.

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          • #6
            To be honest, I’ve stopped watching Liam.

            Mostly not his fault. It’s partially due to my lack of enthusiasm for S7 and also because he’s made us keenly aware of his ongoing issues with his viewership. I can understand his frustration but the revelation (from the comments he’s made) that he’s no longer excited to post BtVS vids, not because of the show but because of the arguments he’s having, is hard to ignore. There’s an air or unpleasantness about the whole thing that sucks out the enjoyment when you know he’s not happy. I’ve also just never been very invested in his reactions to begin with so it’s easier to drop.


            ~ Banner by Nina ~

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            • #7
              I find him still being enthusiastic enough about the show. I have to admit though that I've never watched every episode and I also only ever watch the shorter YouTube vids and those only for the actual reaction, not hos comments. i also stay away from comments on YouTube.

              I have watched failwhale's reaction to When She was Bad.

              I have mixed feelings about him. He is kinda cute and I do believe him to be very genuine. However, due to his (young) age and his overall demeanor he does remind me of my eldest son and that feels a bit weird. It also makes me feel quite old. He does say Boofy sometimes which my little one also does, so that's a plus.

              flow

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              • #8
                I can understand alley box.'s style not being for everyone flow. Generally it makes me smile. I just see it as another way of her emphasising her thoughts and reactions, like Liam's pointedly repeated zooming in on his unamused expression when Cordelia's being, well, Cordelia. It is just that but on helium. Did you ever watch van's reactions flow? If you don't like someone talking during, or being over the top, you can't go wrong with her.

                I'm disappointed to hear that Liam has been affected by getting into the comments but, to be completely honest, going by how clearly irritated he was by being told repeatedly that Buffy originated 'the big bad' I think he should have had someone look through them or just steered clear of them. And once it actually started to affect how he felt about the show he should have just stopped reading them. I appreciate it's difficult when he's trying to engage with those that are watching his vids but having experienced going into an area of fandom where I found it stressful because of how people behaved and what I might read, you have to cut out things like that as it does nothing good for your wellbeing.

                I've started watching SAQ, hopefully will post on those today at some point but I've got Wentworth 1.02 to write up about too.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by flow View Post
                  I find him still being enthusiastic enough about the show. I have to admit though that I've never watched every episode and I also only ever watch the shorter YouTube vids and those only for the actual reaction, not hos comments. i also stay away from comments on YouTube.
                  I think the show itself he's still enthusiastic about. It's unfortunately the fandom that seems to be ruining things for him (or a small minority of it anyway). I have to say, his plea for people to stop telling that he doesn't "get" things (like The Trio or Spuffy) simply because he either doesn't like them or has a different opinion on them really resonated with me. It's been a pet peeve of mine since the reactions began and this is the first time a reactor has outright stated that these attitudes are condescending and bothersome. There's this running commentary that if reactors don't perceive a storyline a certain way or simply don't like a storyline that they're just not 'intelligent' enough, or don't 'get it', or aren't 'perceptive' etc. The simple truth of it is that they just don't have to share our opinions on everything and nor do they have to like everything, either.

                  I actually shared Liam's feelings on The Trio. I find them very dull up until Dead Things where they become really interesting and then I get bored with them again. I get that in episodes like Life Serial or Flooded they're meant to be lame. The story explicitly calls them lame in Smashed ("Is it just me or are all these things really..." "Lame?" "I was going to go with unusual, but yeah") so it's hardly a secret. But the problem I have is that they're meant to be lame and they are lame... so their scenes are... well lame. And because of that I find them dull to watch. Now, that doesn't mean I don't 'get' what the writers were going for. It simply means I don't like it.

                  So I get his frustrations. And I really get his frustrations that people are hellbent on *winking and nudging* about upcoming developments because I'll never understood people who just cannot stop themselves despite the person repeatedly stating they don't wish to be spoiled. But knowing he's so frustrated by everything and has openly admitted he's not looking forward to posting BtVS reactions at the moment is just a bit depressing for me and has created an air of negativity around him and his channel whenever I watch it. To be honest, it's not really his fault, but since I never was as invested in him as a reactor anyway it just meant I could kind of drop him more easily in favour for more positive experiences at the moment.

                  ~ Banner by Nina ~

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                  • #10
                    I've found people prompting about what is to come fairly irritating and I'm only at the start of S2! It's enjoyable seeing people responding to things like you did and reliving that first experience, but seeing people's different responses and how their opinions are building and developing is a real appeal of doing this for me. That's why I'm watching their reactions to all of them. I don't tend to read the comments and have only glanced down on really odd occasions because people's comments have been mentioned or, in van's case, to see if she explained the missing S1 eps. I think Liam would have just been better off stopping reading the comments once it started bothering him.

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                    • #11
                      2.02 Some Assembly Required

                      alley box.
                      She shouldn't be surprised she felt empathy towards a corpse. I mean he is being presented as having personality, emotions, desires etc. Sure, he was dead but he's animated now. You know, like Angel.

                      I wasn't going to be surprised by this not being a huge favourite for anyone but was glad she focussed a good deal on the strengths it has in moving a few relationships forward and for the continuation of Cordelia's gradual inclusion. She seemed to enjoy it well enough. Yet another who's going to be torn up by Passion.


                      failwhale34
                      I've never thought that Angel was intending for Buffy to be jealous in return when Cordelia is doing her 'fragile' routine after she finds the hand in the dumpster. I don't think it was intentional, but I can see that there could have been some satisfaction in it.

                      Picking up on the continuation of elements across the episodes already is an interesting factor in his response and noticing the slight changes in responses of the characters as they are affected by their experiences already is really good. I'm not sure I picked up on those subtle shifts like that so I'm pretty impressed and it's drawn my attention to them in a way I'm sure will affect my next viewing of the eps at the start of S2 which is great.

                      I'm really pleased at how this episode is going down. I really had expected a lot more negativity about it. Not that the weaknesses in the premise aren't getting noticed, but the positives are keeping some balance in a different way. How much is that about adjusting to the show and getting invested in the characters though. Is this episode actually any better than Teacher's Pet, for example? There's a thread it that somehow that I'll try to remember to post at some point.


                      Liam Duke
                      So many hearts are going to be torn up by Passion. It's a guarantee.

                      Another who's not sure about Bangel. Not that I'm sure the age thing is going to really block alley box. enjoying it and she isn't just conscious/confused about that aspect. And Liam is interested in where it is going but, unless I've missed something, hasn't really said anything specific about any reservations. He's conscious Angel gets his own show though and that would surely affect how invested you'd be about the romance. He is certainly expecting them to not be able to last of course and I don't think I had that element when I saw it and had no idea of the sister show.


                      I'm with him that the tragedy is where the best beats on this one are but I think Chris is more likely to be even more traumatised from all of this to be honest. One of the most tragic aspects of this episode for me is that the mum is abandoning her other son while she grieves so deeply for the one she has already lost. And look where Chris' grief led him in trying to deal with his alone too.

                      So is Liam English? He comments on not having science fairs. (Yeah I'm totally rubbish at noticing accents, which is probably part of why DB's Irish one doesn't bother me so much.)


                      van
                      She really does respond and seem to enjoy the romances. Giles/Jenny and Buffy/Angel are quite traditional romances though, it'll be interesting to see how she is with those a bit more complicated like the upcoming Xander/Cordelia one.

                      --

                      I really was expecting to hear comments far, far more damning of this episode. The ep clearly is nobody's favourite, but I thought there would be harsher criticisms. I certainly came to appreciate it a lot more after the rewatch discussions for the ideas and questions of the morality of resurrection, the ties to trauma and how experiences change you, for seeing how people respond and react to each other and also to the effects of popularity. There are interesting things in there for sure. But on a first watch? Not that I hated it, I just think they generally enjoyed it more than I did at first which was interesting in itself.

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                      • #12
                        Yeah, Liams English alright.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Stoney View Post
                          I do like Liam and he has interesting immediate thoughts, but he does ramble and repeat himself quite a bit.
                          That is Liam's biggest flaw in my opinion, that and all the complaining about the comments. I think his complaints are justified (see vampmogs' post) but I agree with vampmogs that they don't make for a fun listening experience. And I agree with you (Stoney) that if they bother him so much, he just should not read them.

                          https://www.youtube.com/c/DoubleDutchess

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                          • #14
                            Yep, sadly he's his own worst enemy imo and now It's impacted on his view of the series, which is a shame.

                            Comment


                            • Stoney
                              Stoney commented
                              Editing a comment
                              It does sound like some fans being obnoxious has played its part though.

                          • #15
                            Originally posted by Silver1 View Post
                            Yep, sadly he's his own worst enemy imo and now It's impacted on his view of the series, which is a shame.
                            Probably because his view of the series was wrapped up in the adulation he got.

                            It's never a good idea for a content provider to have heavy interactions with fans.

                            Comment


                            • #16
                              2.03 School Hard

                              alley box.
                              She seemed almost a little confused by this episode. I suppose it does head things off on a tangent as a new character comes and eliminates an established threat, rather than the gang doing it. I can't remember how strange Dru seemed to me at first as well, but I can see her somewhat confusing things against what you expect too. She takes some adjusting to maybe. I think this alongside the reveal that Snyder/the authorities are aware of more than it seems may have just jarred a little for her against the previously established status quo. But of course it works alongside the element of the episode that shows the disruption and chaos new factors can bring in.

                              This also works against her thought Angel is acting somewhat weird and seeing this perhaps as his response to Spike's sudden arrival and the potential disruption that can mean for him/Buffy as his vampiric connections might be brought forward. And there is that family theme in there which the cut of her reaction gave emphasis to the Buffy/Joyce elements of the episode too and with Buffy's trouble finding that life balance. This actually made me appreciate how this features in the episode for Angel too at this point. So that was a gain on my own perspective on the episode from seeing hers, even if she was a little thrown off by the twists and changes herself.


                              failwhale34
                              I think there is already a noticeable difference in how engaged he seems with the show this season. The chaos and twist factors of the ep seem to have really worked for him and he's interested in Spike's introduction in itself, as well as for what it adds to Angel's character. And more appreciation's here for the exploration of balancing pressures for Buffy.

                              As an aside, I found it really distracting that his picture of the episode was a mirrored one. It probably always has been and I'm only just noticing it now.


                              Liam Duke
                              Really positive reaction to this episode too. Plenty of appreciation for Buffy's school pressure, the inclusion of Joyce, Spike's character intro and the potential to come from that and expansion on the vamp relationship with Angel. It'll be interesting to see how he reacts to Dru as it moves on and he gets more acclimatised to her.

                              You can see the looming impact of some obvious moments as appreciation for characters builds. Like with Joyce's death and the developments of Jenny/Giles that are on the horizon. You know the points that are going to hit really hard of course. But it was a shame to hear that he already knows that Spike eventually becomes a love interest. I'm not sure you'd see him as a threat in the same way that is intended in the early part of this season if you know that is eventually a factor. He commented before the alley clapping moment that he expected Spike was going to be a lovable ars*hole and you've got to wonder how much what he expects of him will be affected by knowing a future point.

                              Now, about the start of this reaction vid... So it turns out Liam has got someone to look through the comments now for spoilers. I was interested that he outright pointed out that people saying to him that he'll come to love Cordelia is a spoiler as it tells him she's going to change. It's a fair point and one I raised and I would be frustrated by such things if I was him too. But I was taken aback by how long he complained about how people were being rude and demanding his reactions increased before he started the episode reaction. There's nine minutes at the start about all of that. To some degree that's because he repeats himself in what he's saying in the same way he does when summarising his reaction to an ep, and while I think he's being a bit harsh on himself when he says he's being miserable because I appreciate why it was annoying, it verges on ranting. Although he's emphasising and insisting he loves the interactions too, despite those few that bother him, he is clearly really very frustrated by the elements he doesn't like and this already isn't the first time he's very openly complained about the comments. It's a shame seeing how he was clearly having such negative experiences with the comments this early that he didn't just pull back from them. It doesn't, yet, affect my enjoyment of his reactions, but I have to say knowing that it continues and will become such a problem for him in the later season is a bit of a hanging cloud. Hopefully the person going through the comments will help to remove some of what has been annoying him so that this isn't a regular feature from so early all the way through.


                              van
                              Well she was very chatty for van during and after watching this one. She seems really taken with the introduction and inclusion of Spike and interested to see what is to come. I really got a sense of the solid pace of the episode through how it carried her interest.

                              And I love her hugely for being a kindred spirit and also not being good with accents.
                              --

                              I think School Hard is an episode that you appreciate even more when you know the characters and all that comes for them, this season and onwards. I'm sure I enjoyed it even more when I rewatched it for the first time. I found Spike interesting and funny from when he first showed up, but wasn't instantly enamoured to the extent I eventually became. He became my favourite character during the process of watching the entire show and in having seen his full arc play out, so that did really add to my enjoyment of this episode when I first rewatched it. But I did originally feel it was a good character intro anyway so I'm glad it was liked by them all.

                              I wondered more recently though if it gets too pedestalled as an episode because it brings in a character that's around for so much of the show. How much was I really affected in my fondness for it because of how much I came to love Spike? With this in the back of my mind, when I last rewatched it the weaknesses in it like JM's stunt double and how false his movement to go to bite Xander looks all started to bother me more. So I really like that these reactions have helped me to shake that off and reappreciate it more again, in how action filled it is, the intrigue it holds of what was to follow and some elements that it brings thematically to the season as well. So yes, a really enjoyable one to have watched the reactions for.

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                              • #17
                                OMG I finally went and had a look at this Alley box women. Jesus Christ whats with all the Dutch angles and pull back and zoom. Does she think It's 'hip'? because to me It comes across a like something out of an old 80's video. Just add a star filter and It would have completed the set!

                                As others have said It makes it very hard to watch and I don't know why she's doing it. Shame, because despite her weird ability to find some very simple shots and plot point confusing, she might actually have something new to say. A big old miss for me sadly.

                                Comment


                                • #18
                                  That's a shame. I can understand why people wouldn't like it but I think she uses it for emphasis in a fun way at points and it is just her producing something distinct and I like how it varies from the straight watch and comment approach. Watching hers and then van's for example is so different I don't care that I'm watching about the same episode. The other two as well are quite distinct, although more typical perhaps, but the variances keeps it interesting for watching a group together.

                                  Comment


                                  • #19
                                    From what I infer, most of Liam's problems with obnoxious fans started from around 6x19 on and him failing to hug the woobie wholeheartedly since then. So whatever problems he may or may not have had in early seasons (I didn't perceive many, but I also don't read much of his YT comments back then), they are going to be worse.
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                                    • Stoney
                                      Stoney commented
                                      Editing a comment
                                      Hmmmph, well at least I might not be hearing he's feeling it again for a long time I suppose.

                                  • #20
                                    Originally posted by Stoney View Post
                                    That's a shame. I can understand why people wouldn't like it but I think she uses it for emphasis in a fun way at points and it is just her producing something distinct and I like how it varies from the straight watch and comment approach. Watching hers and then van's for example is so different I don't care that I'm watching about the same episode. The other two as well are quite distinct, although more typical perhaps, but the variances keeps it interesting for watching a group together.
                                    Thing is It's not something 'different' though. Many other young people online chuck out that kind of style. The bit I hate the most is this 'cute' anime style hand gestures that I've never found appealing and old school quick cuts and zooms. as well as the increasing trend of editing in footage or sounds from a completely different show to add some kind of reference point I guess? Maybe they're too young to realise that you don't need gimmicks to keep your audience, just your brain?

                                    Originally posted by KingofCretins View Post
                                    From what I infer, most of Liam's problems with obnoxious fans started from around 6x19 on and him failing to hug the woobie wholeheartedly since then. So whatever problems he may or may not have had in early seasons (I didn't perceive many, but I also don't read much of his YT comments back then), they are going to be worse.
                                    Alright I'll bite, which one, as you do realise the group he was the most pissed off with was the Tara shippers?
                                    Last edited by Silver1; 15-08-20, 04:38 PM.

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                                    • Stoney
                                      Stoney commented
                                      Editing a comment
                                      Perhaps it is because I don't watch these things, but I find her quite charming and fun.
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