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  • #46
    Yeah, I think so too! I am so excited to see it getting started.

    I actually don't think Buffy's season 7 style is something an older woman would wear. I think it's just very down to earth and practical. Nothing fancy, frilly, or fashionable. To me a lot of her outfits from season 3 scream "older woman" and I wonder if they did that to somewhat soften the age gap between Angel and Buffy. I wasn't watching when season 3 aired and don't really know if there was enough backlash after season 2 to justify such a move.

    flow
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    • flow
      flow commented
      Editing a comment
      Sometimes she is ;-)

    • Stoney
      Stoney commented
      Editing a comment
      But not like the unfashionable, shabby versions I wear though I'm sure.

    • StateOfSiege97
      StateOfSiege97 commented
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      i absolutely agree about S3—
      some of her outfits scream soccer mom...

  • #47
    Originally posted by flow View Post
    Yeah, I think so too! I am so excited to see it getting started.

    I actually don't think Buffy's season 7 style is something an older woman would wear. I think it's just very down to earth and practical. Nothing fancy, frilly, or fashionable. To me a lot of her outfits from season 3 scream "older woman" and I wonder if they did that to somewhat soften the age gap between Angel and Buffy. I wasn't watching when season 3 aired and don't really know if there was enough backlash after season 2 to justify such a move.

    flow
    I don't think Buffy's outfits in S3 have anything to do with Bangel/Angel. I think it's more to do with Faith and them wanting to contrast the two Slayers by making Buffy "the good one" and having her dress pretty conservatively and matronly in comparison to Faith's sexiness/leather. At times they went a little overboard with it, especially at the beginning of Bad Girls before Buffy's follows Faith and starts losing layers and wearing more leather etc.

    I think she's dressed too maturely in S7 too. She's only meant to be 22 in that season - barley out of her teens and still college aged - but she's dressing like someone in their early 30's at least, IMO. Some of her S5 outfits are the same as well such as the top she's wearing during the Buffy/Dawn scene in Triangle which looks straight out Joyce's wardrobe.

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    • #48
      I was using a bit of hyperbole when I said "old lady" for Buffy's S7 outfits, but thirties to middle age, definitely. Actually her outfit in Chosen that I despise is an exception to that, at least partially: apart from the bleh colours, in shape it looks more like something a little girl could wear, in particular the sleeves and the weird collar. Kind of like a Sunday school outfit.

      I agree Buffy also dressed too old for her age in S3, but at least those outfits were stylish and not so boring (more Jackie Kennedy and less old lady).
      https://www.youtube.com/c/DoubleDutchess

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      • #49
        Twenty-three leather jackets or leather coats have made it into the selection for the outfit game. Who would have thought? However, I haven't yet checked if they're all different coats and jackets or if she wore one or another more than once.

        Four denim jackets. All different. Three of them from season 7.

        ETA: Two pics featured the same jacket in different eps. Therefore I kicked one of them out.

        flow
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        • #50
          This question came up on another social media platform and I thought it was funny but also kinda clever at the same time:

          If in season 5 Ben would lose a limb or maybe an eye or such would Glory be missing the same limb or eye when she takes the driver's seat?

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          • #51
            I would say no because their bodies don't 'match' in other ways. They have different genetics and different body parts as opposite genders that come and go with the shift between them. And Ben has his hair cut, but Glory's isn't short too. So I think not.

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            • #52
              That's true but we all know that if he dies she dies too. So, why should his heart failure lead to a failure of her heart whereas the failure of his left kidney would not lead to kidney failure on her part?

              I am sure she would have crippled him if it wouldn't have any negative impact on her own body because that would have weakened him significantly and would have allowed her a more free reign over their shared body. I also think it is said that they share a body or that she is imprisoned in his body. That seems to imply it is the same body just appearing in different shapes. Last not least - she might have simply chosen to appear as a stunning blonde woman but it probably wasn't what she looked like as a god in her own dimension. Maybe her powers only allowed her to change his appearances from a dark-haired male to a blonde female but not to change the body itself. She had a vagina as long as he had a penis but if he had lost that part of his body maybe she would have lost the opposite body part as well.

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              • #53
                I think it is true that she dies if he does just because the body she is trapped within is no longer animated and so she can't appear out from something dead. It would be like permanently sealing a tomb around her I think, rather than it leading to a failure of her heart because his stopped.

                I don't think she crippled him because it served her to remain hidden with him, to not cause him greater reason to try to put his life on the line to end hers. The only danger he held for her was what he might do when she wasn't in control and causing him greater resentment than he already felt and risking a retaliation would make her situation more precarious. The ties between their existences just seem mystical and magical rather in the main to me. But it is certainly true that they aren't totally physically separate. How much of that is affected by how 'well' Glory as the stronger being is I don't know. Ben didn't seem affected by her being dropped from the sky or being hit by a bus. But when she takes the beating in The Gift Ben wakes in physical agony. It is the first time Glory herself was particularly wounded by what she sustained herself though I think and that may have been the difference there. But what she could survive repeatedly should surely have just instantly killed him. So how the line wavers between them on the physical front is hard to say.

                I still feel that Ben losing an arm wouldn't affect Glory though. Perhaps that is because it is her image of herself that she always returning to, that it is how she chooses to be seen that affects the differences as you say.

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                • #54
                  From New York magazine's Vulture section,
                  their list of the 100 best shows streaming
                  on Hulu, listed in alphabetical order, updated
                  Friday:


                  Angel
                  Spin-offs of critically acclaimed shows typically fail. You can use the old axiom that lightning doesn’t strike twice, but it’s truly difficult to get out of the shadow of a major hit. It feels like Angel never quite did escape the legacy of Buffy, which is a shame given how excellent this show became. David Boreanaz’s first (of many) star vehicles ran from 1999-2004 and produced over 100 episodes.


                  Buffy the Vampire Slayer
                  Joss Whedon’s show is still dismissed by some people as a “teen soap opera with fangs,” but anyone who doesn’t recognize how brilliant and important this show is to the history of television simply hasn’t seen it. Buffy helped redefine audience expectations, proving that deep, progressive social commentary could be embedded in a show about monsters, and that people of all ages could get it. There is so many genre programs nowadays — from Stranger Things to Westworld — that owe a debt to this show.



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                  • #55

                    I’ve always been a little fascinated by the interest in the clothing—the grunge—so clean; ha—was not so (poser) great, IMO, but was “of a period” and still socially reminds me of the story of Levi’s. The worker class clothing that “rebellious” youth wore until every permutation of wide legs, embroidery, beading, bells, and bleaching efforts became the the “grunge” theory in thin spot rips and folds that cause dye loss. YET! the color palette remains symbolic.

                    I still love the “deep, hidden, significant, meaning” in the colors of the clothes that reveal Buffy’s “duality” symbolically, whether of the dark and light, loss of ignorance, transformational innocence (renewal), the physical—usually darkening—and the spiritual to the final outfit in “gender equality” of tradition blue and pink, with its further meanings in earth and sky; yet also in ‘practical’ clothing of the reality of “washable” vs. “dry cleaning” and “dictates” of society” vs. independent expression. The most obvious is black pants (sex and darker urgers) with white tops (pure heart/intentions) not to mention black may mean “death” to many, but also is actually “fertile” with white being representative of purity, but also death.

                    I really like the red leather pants and Faith’s sexuality as “ fast and loose” was driven in how she seemed ‘not to care’ but in how she dressed in dark or “tough” clothing versus Buffy’s very feminine expressions. Notice, too, how ‘high heels’ –used as a weapon; ha!—were traded in (for flat ballet shoes mid fight) for boots—I noticed this in the movie girl Buffy whose independence (and fashion dictates—ha!) was in a frilly and short prom dress with combat/paratrooper types of boots for (hee) “comfort.” Men wore high top sneakers with their tuxes and t shirts lithographed to look like tux jacket, shirt and tie. Xander, especially, wears t shirts that reference marijuana or drugs, a lot, not to mention the constant “tea” and actually signs all over the set. I always wondered if this was to be seen as a horror “MidSummer’s Night’s Dream” or only psychological “landscape” in which everything means something else; it seems so!
                    HUGS!
                    Sybil

                    As for ATS, “back in the day” it was a big “squee” for fans, as we considered this “two hours of Buffy” in learning more about the enigmatic Angel having to confront his own startling experience and the potential that loomed in seeing his life unfold. The great effort to launch ATS made Buffy’s choice to guard the hellmouth seem like she was a “baby in a backwater”—until one recalls she actually had experience with LA, all wrapped up in Charisma Carpenter’s Cordelia—the name of the darling daughter of the great fall of Lear. Don’t forget her love for her father compared him to salt, a two poisons that joined are crystallized into a life necessary compound and adds “clarity” to other foods.

                    Further, because Buffy’s crossovers pulled a fledgling show back into the actual power of Buffy’s show, it also finally was a contractual requirement to not even mention Buffy’s name, to a specific number of times. So much controversy occurred because of other “canon” failures. Angel wouldn’t “choose” another woman, after Buffy, even if he “said” she needed a normal, mortal life, so the obvious “romance” for the titular character required all kinds of “delusional” references, whether in drugs, or spells, or even “other worlds,” and using “Mr. Sex on a Stick” imprisoned behind bars to show the psychological power of this evil persona was actually a brave choice upon all the other characters.

                    Further, the “problem” with reflective surfaces and fans even counting finding vampire faces in screen captures turned the wonderful mythology of silver,(moon, female), dimensional portal of mirrors, into some hand wave mealy “photographs badly”—for newsprint copy (wood and water).

                    The biggest problem was Joss overburdened with three shows and ‘firing his mentor’ David Greenwalt, who was the force behind Charisma, and show shifting show runners. I think that many agree the interesting part was Wes and Lilah. HE made the most spectacular journey, while Angel's was tied to "these guys" and inserted Fred, who became THE force as Illyria. THe extra planetary excursions really unmoored the reality of a character dealing with the unseen demons/gods/and "ubiquitous" evil of a law firm that the new CEO couldn't really do anything about, whether to bludgeon, ignore or finally destroy in a meltdown of real estate that effected "the great unwashed" surrounding it more than "all the dithering" that went on, going nowhere, essentially. Entertainment does not mean "greatness" and that is BTVS, IMO, even when "dating" is a distraction. (pun meant).

                    I really learned to appreciate characteristics of the best writers on both of these shows! Especially, Tim Minear: “Are you now or have you ever been?” He is technically pleasing—kinda like a Harlan Ellison or Ursula Le Guin, but “too far” (emotionally in favor of “disgust” or “effect”) is evident in “American Horror.”

                    HUGS!
                    sybil

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                    • #56
                      I just watched Beneath You and I am pretty but not 100% sure that the girl Anya is speaking to in The Bronze, when Buffy, Xander, Spike, and Nancy come in to confront her about the wish that turned Nancy's ex into a worm is actually Martha Jones from Dr. Who/Torchwood.

                      Any thoughts?

                      flow
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                      • #57
                        Originally posted by flow View Post
                        I just watched Beneath You and I am pretty but not 100% sure that the girl Anya is speaking to in The Bronze, when Buffy, Xander, Spike, and Nancy come in to confront her about the wish that turned Nancy's ex into a worm is actually Martha Jones from Dr. Who/Torchwood.

                        Any thoughts?

                        flow
                        Checked IMDb - the actor in "Beneath You" was Benita Krista Nall. You could have seen her face in a number of shows over the past 20 years but doesn't look like she's ever booked many long term gigs other than on "American Dreams". She does look a fair bit like Freema Agyeman though.
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                        • #58
                          Wow, thank you so much. I was so sure it was Martha Jones ... damn. It would have supported my favorite headcanon that Buffy and Dr. Who actually live in the same universe ...

                          flow
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                          • #59
                            Originally posted by flow View Post
                            Wow, thank you so much. I was so sure it was Martha Jones ... damn. It would have supported my favorite headcanon that Buffy and Dr. Who actually live in the same universe ...

                            flow
                            You'll always have 10 and Rose sauntering along the street during "No Future For You", at least.
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