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Twilight and Faith

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  • Twilight and Faith

    In Season 8 Twilight gathered a team around him to help complete his mission. I wonder why he didn't try to convert Faith to his cause. She was disenchanted with the Slayer gig, she wasn't part of Buffy's army, she was in the Cleveland backwater being asked to dust vampire children. She seemed perfect to be recruited for to his cause. Why do you think that didn't happen?

  • #2
    I think that Angel is about smart enough to realize that Faith will not become a sidekick to an old man trying to kill Buffy ever again.

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    • #3
      First of all, I think Angel didn't have a "team", he had minions; he was convinced that he (and later Buffy) was the only protagonist of that grand plan of his.

      The Government was easy to manipulate: there were a real fear of this "new race" of Slayers, and the Government being the Government... they had to be stopped, and Twilight took advantage of their agenda, and used their resources (the Army - its men, its weaponry, its advanced equipment to locate Buffy and Co., etc), plus that stupid (and greedy) General came in handy.

      Amy and Warren were a non-planned (but very welcomed) help: a witch and a nerd genius. Pearl and Nash... well, they were evil and wanted a vendetta against humanity; perfect to be used as a weapon against Slayers.

      Angel knew Faith would never accept to join him and be OK with his crazy, manipulative and cruel plan; she had really changed. She might have been a little jealous of Buffy (like she had demonstrated a few months before), but to join such a plan because she felt disconnect and not fitting anywhere... well, that would have been Faith and The Mayor all over again, and she was way past that.
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      • #4
        I take on board everything you've said, but Faith is so lost and lonely at the start of S8, she's as low as she's ever been. She the go-to girl for killing vampire children, and she stabs Giles with a fork because I think she's suffering ptsd. All of which is why becoming friends with Genevieve the psychopath seems like a good idea. I'm not convinced Faith would have joined forces with her old friend and mentor Angel, but I do think it's a possible and if Joss had gone there, i wouldn't have been too surprised.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Priceless View Post
          I take on board everything you've said, but Faith is so lost and lonely at the start of S8, she's as low as she's ever been.
          Yeah, but that's how you show how you changed - when things are really bad.


          She the go-to girl for killing vampire children, and she stabs Giles with a fork because I think she's suffering ptsd.
          Both Wood and Giles knew Faith wasn't evil anymore, but they lacked some... empathy? I mean, she had done some bad things in the past, and she was a tough and more experienced Slayer by then, but it didn't mean she would kill children with a smile in her face (just) because they were vampires (and the fact that Wood hadn't even bothered to tell her this small detail really hurt her), or it would be easy to kill a human because "she was a threaten to the world" (which was just a lie).


          All of which is why becoming friends with Genevieve the psychopath seems like a good idea.
          So, Faith ended up bonding with Genevieve, found in her some similarities (like being used by older men), and I doubt she would have killed her in cold blood, without making sure how much Genevieve was really a danger to the world. Faith accepted Giles's job out of duty: she was a Slayer - either to kill vampire children or to stop a threat to the planet, it was what she was born to do, after all - and yeah, a little of despondency, I think.

          I'm not convinced Faith would have joined forces with her old friend and mentor Angel, but I do think it's a possible and if Joss had gone there, i wouldn't have been too surprised.
          I would...

          Wow, am I talking about Faith???
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          • #6
            I don't think that it would have been something Angel would have considered because of the risk that she might have disagreed with him and then said something to Buffy. As I remember it was important to the plan that Buffy was dragged down and weakened emotionally. Any risk that she would be tipped off to what was happening wouldn't have been worthwhile. I think Angel believed what he was agreeing to was for the greater good but alarm bells should have been clanging, there was some hubris involved and I think he would have unconsciously avoided being questioned. I don't think Faith would have gone along with it and I think she would have really pushed him on what he was doing.

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            • #7
              I agree that Angel didn't want to be questioned and Faith wouldn't have just gone along with his plans without questioning them at some point. i thought Twilight would have seen how lonely Faith was and how she still blames Buffy for some of her problems, and try to manipulate her. But he wouldn't have stood for being questioned by anyone.

              Wow, am I talking about Faith???
              This is definitely the best Faith has been and she's at her most compelling and likeable. She was in a bad place in Season 3, but she took her jealousy and anger out on Buffy, and I found her hard to feel sorry for because it felt like others were trying to help her, but she turned on them. But in S8 she's alone and suffering, and has no-one to take it out on and I can't help but feel really sorry for her.

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              • #8
                It's been a while, but I have assumed that the reason Angel set Roden in motion at all was precisely to get Genevieve on Giles' radar for the purpose of having her knocked off, precisely because she could have fulfilled the prophesy and this was about having sex with, I mean, um, shaping a new world with Buffy, not just some prophetically convenient Slayer. Yes, I have no trouble assigning venal motives to Angel when his entire participation in this evil was made possible by appealing to his vanity.
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                • #9
                  Originally posted by KingofCretins View Post
                  It's been a while, but I have assumed that the reason Angel set Roden in motion at all was precisely to get Genevieve on Giles' radar for the purpose of having her knocked off, precisely because she could have fulfilled the prophesy and this was about having sex with, I mean, um, shaping a new world with Buffy, not just some prophetically convenient Slayer. Yes, I have no trouble assigning venal motives to Angel when his entire participation in this evil was made possible by appealing to his vanity.
                  I remember Roden being a follower of Twilight (with a guide book and all), and Genevieve thinking she deserved to rule them all (being royal and rich). But if I remember well, the only reason Angel intervened was because she intended to kill Queen Buffy.
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