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Buffy Season 9 News Thread (2)

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  • Buffy Season 9 News Thread (2)

    I thought I would open a Buffy Season 9 news thread since info on the next season should start rolling out after Buffy #40 hits in two weeks and it might be easier to have a giant general news thread for it for right now.

    Here's the first piece of possible rumor/news.A possible season 9 writer.

    Gail Simone Asked To Write For Buffy Season Nine

    Submitted by Rich Johnston
    on January 7, 2011

    We all know that the Joss Whedon showrun comic Buffy The Vampire Slayer Season Eight is coming to a close, and that Buffy The Vampire Slayer Season Nine is to launch from Dark Horse Comics later this year.

    Well now we know that comic book writer Birds Of Prey/Secret Six/Welcome To Tranquility‘s Gail Simone has been asked to write for it.

    I do hope she says yes. I would look forward to her Willow, especially.

    Photo by Laura Gjovaag.

    Originally Posted by AndrewCrossett
    I just think it's a crying shame you've never written for the real Buffy, because your style is right in the Joss Whedon wheelhouse.

    They asked me to, they said I can write as much Buffy as I want, and they sent all the tpbs for me to look at.

    They have been pretty wonderful, actually!

  • #2
    Oh I think it's basically a nuclear option...

    Or in less incendiary terms, it would feel a lot like throwing the baby out with the bath water.

    The comics on an alternate timeline supplanting the show's timeline limits the comprehensibility of the comic to only those people who have followed the comics... which is a fraction of the audience that once watched the show, whose knowledge is based on what they watched on the show, thereby limiting the comics potential target audience to what they currently have (barring any future attrition).

    Yeah, yeah, I know Trek and its relaunch. But we're talking summer action movies which have their own target audience, which is broad. Buffy comics are far more of a niche product from the get go; one whose audience is largely folks who watched the show. Having a comic run as an in-tandem alternative to the show makes it that much easier for those less inclined towards the comics to dismiss them entirely. If the whole enterprise to date is wiped out through its own reset... why bother? A question of 'canon' becomes null. By wholly separating themselves from the show, the comic will have rendered itself superfluous.

    I'm not saying that they won't or they can't go that route. That is entirely up to them. Their toys, they get to decide how to play with them. They can do whatever they like.

    I'm sure there are folks who will be/would be interested, so I'm not saying my response would in any way be universal or reflect the majority. The whole project would no doubt survive and continue.

    Personally, however, I'd be done. I followed these characters through a journey. If that journey is done, so am I. (But that's a personal response. I don't imply it would be anyone else's.)
    Last edited by shipperx; 20-02-13, 08:08 PM.
    Learning Experience: " of those things that says, "You know that thing you just did? Don't do that.”
    ~Douglas Adams


    • #3
      Originally posted by KingofCretins View Post
      There are, ontologically speaking, already alternate timelines containing every eventuality. Joyce had her fire axe handled better and actually cleaved Spike's head open in one, allowing Buffy to leisurely stake the quivering mass; in another, Cecily swooned at the word "effulgent", married William and they were wealthy, elderly first class passengers who died in the maiden voyage of the Titanic.

      See what I'm getting at? All we're talking about with an 'Abrams reboot' is a) adopting one of those infinite alternates out of the Whole Sort of General Mish Mash and adopting it as the "POV" timeline for an ongoing series of stories.

      And that doesn't violate Spike or anyone else, because the outcomes in the infinite variety of timelines are entirely independent.
      OK but we are watching a current one aren't we, we have spent 9 seasons watching alternate universe A so either we are leaving them and no longer watching them whilst they continue without us or that timeline/universe is being stopped and reversed (as with all the other alternates that we weren't watching) and we start watching from point 0 again as all the versions start building from scratch, yes? In one universe at least Spike will presumably again get his soul perhaps but I don't like the feeling that Spike in universe A that I have been watching when reversed back may not be the one that does get it when he had had it. I know to a degree it is nonsensical because once it is reversed for everyone he has the chance to do it again and never had achieved it because time is taken back, but we know that factually he had and he did. If noone retains any memories then at least time was literally reversed. And anyway, from the point it restarts it is Spike who then becomes all the alternates as the decisions and possibilities split etc etc so it is him whenever he does get it back, whichever 'him' in whatever universe achieves it. Ach, we'll see what they do. I don't have a general problem with it as I said, Spike's soul is the only thing that bugs me and, as I said, it will be more like we stopped watching universe A and started watching how universe B panned out. But doesn't that essentially mean there is a permanent loop where our current universe and it's current problems will happen again probably in universe R's rerun and they will just reboot when they get to S9 eventually too?? This sort of thing gives me a twitch.

      I think my overriding feeling is that I don't want to lose my investment in what these characters have been through and become but a little part of me would rather go back to SD than have another season of robot reveals and non existent pregnancies whilst Buffy yet again realises she is the slayer. But I don't believe it will suddenly be more like the TV show so it probably wouldn't be a huge gain. I don't have any opinion at all as to whether that is what they are heading to or not and from what Dorotea says this is a repeat worry anyway so perhaps we are just at that stage of the season when this idea is teased/raised, I don't know I wasn't in the fandom for S8, but anyway, that is why I have mostly kept out of this discussion.
      Last edited by Stoney; 20-02-13, 09:07 PM.


      • #4
        Well, now we know Spike will be back by 22

        Again coming right at the center point in the "battle" of the season. The Scobies will be together again to save Dawn, To defeat Severin and Simone and I guess to bring magic back. The "juicy" parts of the story, but well, mostly what I care about is the Spuffy stuff. Im spuffy ergo Im here.

        So, how black is the future for Spuffy??. He is back, they have lots of unresolved issues, and now there is the theory that he could become human via Severin attack. How that could help??.
        I hate the idea that Buffy will be more open to a relationship, or better, to accept her feelings if he is human and "normal" like her. It will be...sad, and very diminishing for Spike. And I would hate more if he becomes human and she keeps refusing him....arggg. There´s is not positive for me there.
        My solution will be....he becomes human, temporarily, Buffy becomes accepting (Whatabitch), they defeat Severin, Spike decides to reclaim his vampire status (IfyouwantmeyougetmeasIam), and then Buffy will be sad, and confused, and in denial again (allbacktonormal)
        Last edited by claudiawenlock; 13-03-13, 03:36 AM.


        • #5
          Well, no idea where to post this. I had to check here and see if Spike would be back in 22, which I had predicted months ago. I'm glad I was right (for a change). Only thing to be glad about. I don't see how Spike coming back this late in the game will amount to anything other than helping Buffy a bit. I see no dealing of Spuffy in the future (romance or love wise, just plot wise).

          What I hope, seriously, is that that cover is about Spike being upset over Dawn and not his situation with Buffy. Because if he is more upset over Dawn that leads to his dealings with Buffy in a way I find more interesting. If Spike is also let down and feeling frustrated with Buffy over Dawn and that is causing a contention between the two than just "Oh she doesn't love me, I'm rejected again" I will feel better about the whole thing.

          I don't think it will be just a rehash of what was said with Xander, since I think Spike would be more sympathetic to Buffy. However if he also lays it into her but then helps her through it and maybe gets her to come out of denial just a tad, I think that would be more valuable than anything else they could possible throw out there.

          I doubt that there will be any real "spuffy" any more in season 9, but just maybe, jjuuussst maybe, Spike will actually help Buffy resolve an issue or two before he either goes off on his own or becomes human (which would, in my opinion hinder spuffy...for a while at least).
          Last edited by Tennyoelf; 14-03-13, 03:51 AM.


          • #6
            If you look at the solicitations and covers they always kinda describe what happened in the previous issue, so I think Spike will be back in #21.

            As for the turning human thing, if that will happen I think both Buffy and Spike are aimed at. And with the introduction of Billy, a human Buffy could still call herself a slayer
            "Gunn dies, Illyria Survives, Spike shanshus, Angel looses an arm and Xander looses an arm too, which is odd because he wasn't even there."
            Joss Whedon at the High Stakes convention - 2004


            • #7
              At the moment (and it could well change tomorrow!) I think that they are going for Spike really moving on. I do think they love each other but looking over the season so far... the girl at the party, Buffy caring enough to think of him for support with the abortion/caring if he loves her but not able to commit/not seeing them as compatible, the option of Morgan refused, the opportunity for some escapism/ego boost/rebound sex with Harmony taken... I think it has all been to nudge fans into accepting Spike with someone else. I don't think it necessarily means Spuffy is over forever but it could be off the cards for a season or two. But if Spike returns to Buffy's title and meets someone, a nice viable alternative such as another slayer who is really interested in him and values him I think this may be where they head. If they just had Spike arrive and move on fans would not have bought into the new relationship but if, following the season developments I just described, Spike meets someone good/nice/funny/sassy etc etc then it will feel to a lot of fans like he deserves to be treated well, he deserves to find love the way he offers it and it is a great move on from that urk moment with Harmony (but believable that he could be ready as he has been through all this progress I just described and we have had the rebound moment, specifically labelled to us as such).

              As I said, that is just what I'm thinking today. In particular because of the Harmony inclusion I think we are being played into accepting what is coming next more readily. Sure I would like him and Buffy to actually give it a proper go because I would like him to get to have that, but if Spike actually meets someone else he genuinely has a connection with/falls for I will be happy for him, because he does deserve to have a fully positive romantic emotional relationship with a woman. Cripes he's around 150, it would be about time!! They may even go for Buffy working through jealousy for a season and then be back to Spuffy the next season, or they may drop it full stop. Heck he may turn up in a couple of issues get zapped by Severin, become human and they make a go of it, who knows. There are sooo many options but right now, today, I feel like I am being led into being happy with a situation that may have felt wrong if it happened from the start.


              • #8
                I find the whole thing a puzzlement, to be honest. They didn't have to spend a season weaning fans off the idea of Spuffy. Spike had already made a start on a life on his own in AtS 5. They could have done an early arc in season 8 where Spike and Buffy bump into each other, have the conversation about how it's over, and that's it. Since it's Buffy's book, not Spike's, not much time at all needs to be done on his broken heart. They could fly him back off to IDW, and then bring him back into Buffy's story in some other capacity further down the road.

                Or if they didn't feel they could do that early arc, they could have just omitted the whole Buffy fantasy scene in #37. They could have brought Spike in already having moved on emotionally. I mean in terms of easing fans into it they have all of AtS #5, they have AtF, they have Buffy being shown to be all about anyone who isn't Spike (Satsu, Angel, Xander) -- all of which could have been made to have more impact by making it clear that she's doing all that while knowing Spike is alive and well.

                If they have to wean fans off it now, it's because they chose to show Buffy's fantasy, and then write Spike as being as fixated on Buffy as he ever was. Why amp up the problem to be solved, necessitating considerable story time on a relationship that was over years ago?

                That makes me think that there will, in fact, be more Spuffy to come. And if you read the Spike side of the story, that seems obvious. They've spent a lot of time on his feelings about her. And I think the message of this issue is not that he's in fact moving on, but rather that he's not close to moving on. Faith and the aunts reject him not because he's not hot enough, but because they instinctively know he's looking for a Buffy substitute and that sort of thing never works. The Harmony thing is meaningless and isn't going to help Spike move on a jot. Look at what Christos has to say about it -- something to the effect of "newsflash, you can sleep with someone while you're in love with someone else". I'll have to reread, but I didn't see anything from Christos that suggests that Spike's getting over Buffy any time soon. Allie has repeatedly said that Spike's not getting over Buffy, but he is getting into a better place with things.

                My disconnect is that I don't really see what they are doing on Buffy's side of things that points at a Spuffy continuation. If I had to guess, though, it goes like this. Buffy does love Spike. He's the one person she can show her whole self to. She totally counts on him. But she doesn't know how to fit him into her life. She's not going to fly around with him on some roach-infested ship. Also, he's a vampire. And as usual, her bad experience with Angel is going to taint how she can see Spike. She's not about to get into another supernatural relationship after Twilight. So she lets him go without a word. She couldn't say yes, but neither could she say no. (If ever there was a time for the "I care about you a lot, but I just don't feel that thang" -- it was in their last conversation). But instead we get her epic silences, followed up by the wistful look into the sky as he flies away with the connecting bubble talking about this being a mistake.

                Since then they have name-checked Spike regularly. Georges said he specifically kept Buffy's expression obscure in the panel where she discusses Spike with Kennedy to save up for the moment he comes back. We see her instantly think Spike is the guy Illyria is talking about, and thinking of him in terms of their romantic impasse (awkward). Most importantly, we see her being steered by others towards Dowling. If ever there was a placeholder that's it. Nothing was done to organically build to that. His creds are entirely that he's not Spike. It looms large with Christos that Spike himself wanted to engineer Buffy/Dowling on the grounds that he represents the kind of normal that might be good for her. It's in the text that Dawn sells him to Buffy as not-Spike. He's just nearly died and the text hasn't spent so much as a half a line on Buffy being brought up to speed on his status -- in fact it's very easy to forget that he just nearly died.

                Now, personally, I think this all still blows, because we've got Spike being all about Buffy, and Buffy actually being about Spike more than she thinks -- but very much absorbed in other things. And when I put it like that, I agree with you that they are moving away from Spuffy. But that conclusion doesn't fit everything I've just spelled out. So I am confused.

                I keep asking myself what's the "Buffy" of Spike being in her story right now. And the best I can do is this. She's lost her connections with almost everyone. But she's got the one guy she can really truly count on right. there. But she can't let herself see him. That's why we have the "alone again" thought over Spike's departing ship in #40; and the "this is a mistake" thought over Spike's departing ship in season 9. She was attracted to the ersatz normal life in the robot arc, and was just embarking on an ersatz normal relationship in Welcome to the Team (with a new team of folks all of whom are shown as just being on the team without any effort on the part of the writers to organically develop a relationship between Buffy and any of them)*. The drama of the season has the Scoobies finally coming back together, and then Spike will appear. Her real team, and her real romantic interest. But all after she's had a season of trying to figure out who she is, etc. It's not been executed well (to say the least). But the only reason I can see to have Spike in this story is that he represents a real connection in Buffy's life in a season where Buffy is struggling with the real -- presumably because of the jumbled fallout from Twilight.

                *They obviously intend to keep Billy, but presumably the story in season 10 would be about him becoming a real member of the team rather than a blank substitute to fill the gap left by Buffy's loss of her real team. And I suppose they could go back and try to build Dowling into a real romantic interest. But he isn't one now. His entire role in the story now is to be not-Spike, which of course means that the real story is about Spike. Just like the real story is about Buffy/Xander/Willow/Dawn and not Buffy/Billy/Dowling.
                "I don't want to be this good-looking and athletic. We all have crosses to bear." Banner Credit: Vampmogs


                • #9
                  I suppose it was just the use of rebound that made me suddenly prick up my ears (so to speak obviously) and wonder if I had been misreading it. I am probably falsely putting weight on that phrase and that event. I think you are right, it didn't square well with the mini which was why I was confused and felt that perhaps they were saying he was determined to move on now even though he hadn't really. It would be odd, for how the season as a whole played the Spuffy angle for it to not get readdressed on his return. I have to say though, I want Spike to get the girl as long as he wants to (as you know) but even I have limits before I will want to clip him around the head and suggest he moves on. If he returns and stays, something needs to change.

                  (Ooo, next episode of Angel tonight btw )


                  • #10
                    I don't like to speculate, but it'd be a terrible idea to have Spike 'moving on' from Buffy. At least so soon.

                    It would simply seem a way to 'open the door' for Buffy/Angel.

                    But in-story, Spike's been away from Buffy for months and years at a time. In ways, Buffy's been pining for him since "Chosen" (7.22) (Just because she's not sure exactly what she wants from him, doesn't mean she doesn't want to be with him.).

                    Is he really going to come back to BtVS and tell her, "Yeah, I decided I don't want to be with you anymore. I hope you had some fulfilling relationships and/or sex since 2003 {which was like 3-10 years ago}, because otherwise you wasted your 20's. Oh, did I mention that I had sex with Harmony on two occasions since the Hellmouth was destroyed, that Twinkle stuff is about me and I was with Maria Harley (Spider) for months, and had sex with dozens of other immortal beauties during those months as well. Oh, and since I last left you I made out with a succubus (who along with Dru, Spider (who's immortal), this young hot fire elemental named Beck) is totally in love with me and wants to be with me. Oh, and a little after that whole Hell-LA thing that no one told you anything about, I made out with Dru for several minutes and we shared the same hotel room and I listened in while she showered. How's your love life been?"

                    Also, we still don't even know when and how Buffy found out Spike was alive.
                    Last edited by MikeB; 30-03-13, 10:17 PM. Reason: added more information


                    • #11
                      Ha, if he wanted to sound like an utter pillock he could say that. I mean really, how desperately pathetic and insecure would that make him sound.

                      (Some of those are assumptions unconfirmed in text and not all those relevant titles are even confirmed canon. But really, lets not start having great debates about every conquest you wish Spike had definitely had again.)


                      • #12
                        Maggie's quote
                        Since then they have name-checked Spike regularly.
                        I believe this is a very good point. I may be wrong, but don't recall even one time when Buffy directly mentioned Spike during season 8. I know there were issues with the rights on the character and stuff, but still. He is present in her thoughts, just as it was during seasons 6 and 7. This should mean something, because if it doesn't, it would be an awfully big continuity mistake, IMHO.


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by claudiawenlock View Post

                          Again coming right at the center point in the "battle" of the season. The Scobies will be together again to save Dawn, To defeat Severin and Simone and I guess to bring magic back. The "juicy" parts of the story, but well, mostly what I care about is the Spuffy stuff. Im spuffy ergo Im here.

                          So, how black is the future for Spuffy??. He is back, they have lots of unresolved issues, and now there is the theory that he could become human via Severin attack. How that could help??.
                          I hate the idea that Buffy will be more open to a relationship, or better, to accept her feelings if he is human and "normal" like her. It will be...sad, and very diminishing for Spike. And I would hate more if he becomes human and she keeps refusing him....arggg. There´s is not positive for me there.
                          My solution will be....he becomes human, temporarily, Buffy becomes accepting (Whatabitch), they defeat Severin, Spike decides to reclaim his vampire status (IfyouwantmeyougetmeasIam), and then Buffy will be sad, and confused, and in denial again (allbacktonormal)
                          I always felt they were going to make him human/part human, right from the get go since I saw that one panel where he was leaving. All my years studying cinematic composition, symbolism, art, screenwriting and story telling, I thought I spotted subtle suggestion there straight off the bat and not so subtle suggestion in other places. I could be wrong but I still feel this is going to happen. Spike will also be a father at some point, maybe not with Buffy, but he will be a father. Heck I'm almost certain they had this outlined from Angel season 5 if they were to ever continue the story, there were hints way back then. All signs so far IMO point to it being Buffy but it may not be. Them humanising Spike is not a move to destroy his essence or make him more appealing to Buffy. If they were to do it, its only because they want him to be able to be a father at some point.
                          Last edited by BuffySpike; 02-04-13, 11:14 PM.
                          Bonehead, carrot top, shirty & dope
                          the nonsensical vocabulary of Buffy and Spike


                          • #14
                            Hey! Haven't seen you for a while!

                            I'm not sure, I think there are hints but of course they could be fake outs. It would be nice if he chose it in some way rather than just getting humanised by Severin although the story could then be him embracing it.


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by BuffySpike View Post
                              Spike will also be a father at some point, maybe not with Buffy, but he will be a father.
                              I'd really love to see this, in fact, the way you say it makes it sound like it's actually possible (that they are planning this for Spike, I mean). The thing is, wouldn't this another thing Angel already did/have?

                              Well, it always may be another thing that happened to Angel, but Spike willingly sought... Wouldn't that be something...

                              And... Whoa! What it would be for Buffy to see him with a another woman's kid?