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Buffy S11 #12 Issue Discussion Thread(Full Spoilers)

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  • Buffy S11 #12 Issue Discussion Thread(Full Spoilers)

    Opening the thread for the final Buffy issue of season 11.

  • #2
    As usual I've only had my first read through and I'd actually like to look back again at the scene between Buffy and Jordan in particular. I feel I need to really have a think through the huge number of messages over power/responsibility in this season. Obviously the fear of the power of others, the abuse of power are there. The experience of having lost power that feels a natural part of you shown with both Buffy and Willow in the season and then the dragon. But also stolen power, both with Wise from the dragon and supernatural creatures, but also then for differing reasons in Buffy's draw of the slayer powers and in Willow's drain of the other wiccans too. Jordan talked of Buffy having shared the power originally but Faith also told her to use 'their' power when fighting Wise. The whole mix of what is natural, what is shared, what is taken, what is abused, what is deserved, how it is a burden and how it is a gift draws from so many places across the series I really want to reread and consider all that this season covered and how it adds in. And although she may not be gone for good, I actually liked that Calliope possibly just doesn't want to opt back into that world. It seems right that not everyone would after the experience they had. It contrasted against how Jordan et al responded. I liked the moment when they were empowered again where there was a pause to see if they were going to leave calmly. I would welcome seeing Jordan's character return, one of the best originals we've had I think.

    And I liked that the dragon came and took its power back from Wise. That there was something more than our guys, the natural world fought back too. We also had the return to some extent of the divide illustrated with Vicki which was welcome for me. Drawing together for a common goal but not actually bridging the divide fully works with the greys but doesn't ignore that there are definite breaks/differences still there.

    The final group meet on the roof brought us full circle of course in the season to where they started and I like getting these little builds of the lives they are leading together. A great family feel to it and with Buffy feeling so much more at ease in herself after all that the season brought. And of course we have the ILY again. It was pretty expected, especially with that link back to him stopping her saying it when they were in camp, but coming just at a relaxed, undramatic moment, stated/accepted in a really straight forward, loving moment just felt very right for where we have been seeing the Spike/Buffy relationship get to. I have really enjoyed having time away from intense focus on relationship angst and it being more about the situations they are facing. Plus there is plenty of scope for continuing relationship developments that focus on individual issues being explored. These guys may be together for some time yet and that is more than fine with me.

    I found the food comment from Spike a bit awkward and wondered if Gage was trying to add the previous reference in S10 (I think it was) where Spike made a similar comment in response to the suggestion of going out for food. This seemed less out of step with what the series showed if you add in the viewer knowledge that he liked spicy foods as they would add stronger flavours, but it still felt a bit odd and a little clunky for continuity without that. Perhaps this is going somewhere in the future as again his need for blood and her helping him feed was a part of it all again (as it had been in camp). There is still scope for the blast of magic he had having altered/affected him somehow. But perhaps that feels a little too convenient for change to come from. We'll see, when and if we get a S12.

    With no news so far on that front it seems commonly considered that this may possibly be announced after/around the Giles mini next year, as that is promoted as S11. The announcement could of course also be waiting for Angel to finish this season. I'm looking forward to the Giles story in February, and finding out what will follow after it, if anything.

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    • #3
      Christos Gage Slayalive Q/A for Buffy # 12 has started.

      http://slayalive.com/showthread.php/...-Christos-Gage

      Rebekah Isaacs Slayalive Q/A for Buffy # 12 has started.

      http://slayalive.com/showthread.php/...416#post125416

      Comment


      • #4
        Bangels in shambles!!!



        Buffy/Angel

        03.10.1997 - 10.25.2017

        RIP



        So...between Buffy telling Spike that she loves him and Angel kissing another woman, ON THE SAME DAY ( it's like they're trying to tell you something shippers! ) it appears to me that Buffy/Angel has finally, truly, undeniably come to a conclusion, no? In other words, it's over, bangel is finished! I wonder, how will Buffy/Angel shippers deal with this development? Will they find closure? Will they ever recover? Only time will tell.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by a thing of evil View Post


          Buffy/Angel

          03.10.1997 - 10.25.2017

          RIP



          So...between Buffy telling Spike that she loves him and Angel kissing another woman, ON THE SAME DAY ( it's like they're trying to tell you something shippers! ) it appears to me that Buffy/Angel has finally, truly, undeniably come to a conclusion, no? In other words, it's over, bangel is finished! I wonder, how will Buffy/Angel shippers deal with this development? Will they find closure? Will they ever recover? Only time will tell.
          Well,speaking as a B/Aer,I can say for myself,I don't feel good.For spuffy fans,I'm glad they are enjoying things.For myself as B/Aer I feel very down.And as I posted in the Angel # 10 thread.I'm considering not continuing if there is a season 12.There are several factors such as financial(I buy a lot of comics and have had to make cuts due to price and amount of books I get) and in Angel's case being very disappointed in the season.But as I said in the other thread even with the aspects that I still enjoy,the spuffy factor is becoming a bigger and bigger issue for me in my enjoyment overall.Add on this Angel/Illyria development on top of what I think has been a poor story for Angel this season.This all equals me considering it's time to call it a day wtth the comics.Which I feel sad about since I've been with the Buffyverse for 20 years come Jan.My first episodes of Buffy that I saw was "Surprise" and "Innocence.".The two night even in Jan 98 when Buffy moved from Mondays to Tuesdays(The start of The WB New Tuesdays).

          I'll have todays issues later in the week so I can read them then.I'll post my overall thoughts on Buffy's book this season shortly after that.

          I'll finish Angel this season and probably read the Giles miniseries and than I'll decide once there is some season 12 news if I'll continue.

          But,yeah as a B/A shipper,I'm not feeling good at all and may not continue post season 11.We'll see on that.

          ETA

          Even if I decide not to read season 12,I'll still be keeping up on it via the boards and sites.I'll still bring over news.I just won't comment on things probably since I wouldn't be reading the issues.
          Last edited by BAF; 25-10-17, 06:08 PM.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by BAF View Post
            Well,speaking as a B/Aer,I can say for myself,I don't feel good.For spuffy fans,I'm glad they are enjoying things.For myself as B/Aer I feel very down.And as I posted in the Angel # 10 thread.I'm considering not continuing if there is a season 12.There are several factors such as financial(I buy a lot of comics and have had to make cuts due to price and amount of books I get) and in Angel's case being very disappointed in the season.But as I said in the other thread even with the aspects that I still enjoy,the spuffy factor is becoming a bigger and bigger issue for me in my enjoyment overall.Add on this Angel/Illyria development on top of what I think has been a poor story for Angel this season.This all equals me considering it's time to call it a day wtth the comics.Which I feel sad about since I've been with the Buffyverse for 20 years come Jan.My first episodes of Buffy that I saw was "Surprise" and "Innocence.".The two night even in Jan 98 when Buffy moved from Mondays to Tuesdays(The start of The WB New Tuesdays).

            I'll have todays issues later in the week so I can read them then.I'll post my overall thoughts on Buffy's book this season shortly after that.

            I'll finish Angel this season and probably read the Giles miniseries and than I'll decide once there is some season 12 news if I'll continue.

            But,yeah as a B/A shipper,I'm not feeling good at all and may not continue post season 11.We'll see on that.
            Sorry for butting in, I haven't written on the forum in forever, but I have been reading the threads. I'm not reading the comics, because I'm not into comic books, so I don't feel like spending money on something I'm not too keen about. However, I have been keeping up as much as I can, reading online reviews and discussions and looking at any scan of the panels I could find, so I feel I can comment.

            I'm very happy with were Spike and Buffy are now (even though I always wish we could have seen it on the actual tv show, which would have made a whole lotta difference). It's the natural progression/destination for their characters and their relationship, at least for how I understand them. BUT (there's always a but) while I'm as big a Spuffy shipper as they come and I would therefore be exstatic to agree with a thing of evil's assessment that Bangel Is Dead †, I wouldn't bet on it (not even a cent). I selfishly would wish for nothing else, but imo as long as the Buffyverse is alive in some form, the door will never be closed definitely on either ship.

            Right now it's Spuffy's turn to shine (and it was about time, if you ask me, since they were never allowed to have a proper relationship on the show), but I can't let myself hope for even one second that it's gonna stay that way forever. So, as a Spuffy shipper I'm not about to sing "na na na na, we won!!!!! Take that Bangel fiends!" anytime soon, and I honestly think you guys shouldn't despair. We don't know how long these comics will continue, and with a fantasy series like Buffy anything can happen any minute. And Bangel rearing its ugly head again is more likely than many other options!!

            I just don't see TPTB as willing to close the door for good on the whole "who's Buffy going to end up with?" or "Angel or Spike?" questions. I don't dare to believe. If they do, I'll be very surprised.

            Well, this is me, trying to console a Bangel shipper. Stranger things have happened, I believe.

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            • #7
              Buffy/Spike vs. Buffy/Angel was actually over by the end of "Chosen" (B 7.22).

              The episode is called "Chosen", Buffy shoos Angel away in favor of being with Spike, she tells Spike she loves Spike, and the last line in the TV Buffyverse is "Spike."

              Everything after simply reinforced that Buffy prefers Spike to Angel and loves Spike more than she loves Angel.

              Post-"Chosen", the main problem has been Spike's regard for Buffy; for example, Buffy-Buffybot in BtVS S9 was shocked that Spike was in love with her. Then Spike leaves town.

              BTW, by the end of BtVS S7, the only things from "Something Blue" (B 4.09) that hadn't happened is (1) Buffy and Spike holding hands, and (2) Buffy and Spike's being engaged to each other.

              Edit: The reality is that it doesn't make much sense in-Buffyverse that Spike didn't go back to Buffy in AtS s5.
              Last edited by MikeB; 25-10-17, 06:46 PM. Reason: adding more stuff

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Francy View Post
                Sorry for butting in, I haven't written on the forum in forever, but I have been reading the threads. I'm not reading the comics, because I'm not into comic books, so I don't feel like spending money on something I'm not too keen about. However, I have been keeping up as much as I can, reading online reviews and discussions and looking at any scan of the panels I could find, so I feel I can comment.

                I'm very happy with were Spike and Buffy are now (even though I always wish we could have seen it on the actual tv show, which would have made a whole lotta difference). It's the natural progression/destination for their characters and their relationship, at least for how I understand them. BUT (there's always a but) while I'm as big a Spuffy shipper as they come and I would therefore be exstatic to agree with a thing of evil's assessment that Bangel Is Dead †, I wouldn't bet on it (not even a cent). I selfishly would wish for nothing else, but imo as long as the Buffyverse is alive in some form, the door will never be closed definitely on either ship.

                Right now it's Spuffy's turn to shine (and it was about time, if you ask me, since they were never allowed to have a proper relationship on the show), but I can't let myself hope for even one second that it's gonna stay that way forever. So, as a Spuffy shipper I'm not about to sing "na na na na, we won!!!!! Take that Bangel fiends!" anytime soon, and I honestly think you guys shouldn't despair. We don't know how long these comics will continue, and with a fantasy series like Buffy anything can happen any minute. And Bangel rearing its ugly head again is more likely than many other options!!

                I just don't see TPTB as willing to close the door for good on the whole "who's Buffy going to end up with?" or "Angel or Spike?" questions. I don't dare to believe. If they do, I'll be very surprised.

                Well, this is me, trying to console a Bangel shipper. Stranger things have happened, I believe.
                I appreciate the thoughts.And like I've said before.As a B/Aer,I'm very unhappy but I'm glad you and other spuffy shippers are enjoying things right now.
                Last edited by BAF; 25-10-17, 07:08 PM.

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                • #9
                  Buffy:

                  ...and I'm fighting monsters. Like I have since I was fifteen. (#1)

                  Being a Slayer is only part of that. But it's an important part. (#12)


                  Great finale!

                  More than defeating the Big Bad Joanna Wise, Buffy and Co. managed to reach a point where the biggest bads of their lives have been truly defeated. No more fear of loving, no more doubts about what they are, no more feelings of carrying unfair burdens.

                  Mainly the Slayer - she is again The Chosen One – but this time, it was Buffy herself who has chosen the mantle of protector of the world. And don't worry folks, Faith has got her power back (as well as Jordan and her cronies).

                  Willow understands her power more than ever, as well as her role in the magic world – she is the wise one.

                  Spike has found his place among the living, he fights the good fight because it’s the right thing to do, without trying desperately to compensate the many wrongs he did in the past – which is counterproductive, to say the least.

                  Xander and Dawn have found each other, as well as their role within the group; being normal (as much as The Key can be called “normal”) isn’t a hindrance, Xander isn’t (and doesn’t feel like he was) that watcher anymore.

                  And the heroes of this piece are – Riley and Sam Finn! Only to give some answers to the general public, and avoid trouble for Buffy & friends. And they did their part helping the Scoobies; so from now on I will definitively stop doubting Riley’s motivations.

                  The Shenlong – a force of nature – survived the ordeal. Cool! Joanna Wise shouldn’t have messed with him; awaking the dragon to do her bidding was an unwise (see what I did here?) idea: nature when is mistreated responds accordingly, sometimes violently (and in some cases eats you alive).

                  And last but not least: Buffy is finally healed. The time of being in love (for so long), but incapable of saying those 3 little words is over.

                  She said it. To Spike. I love you.
                  My Tumblr: Dog is My Copilot

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                  • #10
                    Read the final issue - it ends so neat and tidy that I almost expect Season 12 to begin with some kind of horrifying attack that wipes out half the cast. Whenever Buffy says those words, something dreadful happens. Poor Spike.

                    Or lucky Spike - Spuffy is it for now - but love in Buffy is always precarious and soon lost. Five years from now, Bangel might be an item again. Let's see what happens when Drusilla returns to muck things up.

                    One thing I can guarantee - Lin-Manuel Miranda would never cast Harmony in ANYTHING. Trust me. Has to be the result of a magic spell.

                    Nice to see the musical reference at the end though.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I had the same thoughts about this issue that I had about the last few issues. It was okay.

                      Nothing mind blowing happened, kinda felt like they were ticking off a bunch of things to wrap up. As I predicted, Wise got eaten by the dragon.

                      We didn't get any answers to some of the oh-so adult and political questions raised in the first few issues. Is it okay to indiscriminately kill vampires/some demons again?

                      Looks like Vicky is about to kill some guys, I guess that blood is on Buffy's hands.

                      Buffy re-activated that Chosen spell. So that means undoing it last issue was completely pointless. She didn't show any sort of new skills or powers in her battle against Ms. Wise that she couldn't have done as normal-Slayer-Buffy.

                      Kinda lame that Faith got re-activated separately and offscreen. What was the point of that, why couldn't she get activated again along with Jordan, Satsu and the others? The activation spell should be an all-or-nothing thing.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by American Aurora View Post
                        Read the final issue - it ends so neat and tidy that I almost expect Season 12 to begin with some kind of horrifying attack that wipes out half the cast. Whenever Buffy says those words, something dreadful happens. Poor Spike.
                        We just did that this season. Or not, as it was minus everyone dying.

                        It just reminded me of the, "Sure! We saved the world. I say we party!" endings of BtVS. Except these days its, "We saved the world. I say rooftop BBQ" though.

                        The grey space for demons (Vicki) and slayers (Jordan) felt raised as an unresolved question that should get some exploration and could well prompt a visit from Dru if we get another season.

                        Or lucky Spike - Spuffy is it for now - but love in Buffy is always precarious and soon lost. Five years from now, Bangel might be an item again. Let's see what happens when Drusilla returns to muck things up.
                        I really would like to see Spike/Dru meet again in canon but I think the only potential angst they could go to there would be if she is getting dusted or they are arguing about looking to do so, which would work well to do following this season I think. As Spike turned away from Dru in S5, it would be odd for her to manage to create relationship angst just by being there I think. But yeah, whilst the ily too made me smile I did wonder if this meant they would go for a season more on the angst front next, assuming there is one.

                        Originally posted by Vampire in Rug View Post
                        Looks like Vicky is about to kill some guys, I guess that blood is on Buffy's hands.
                        Hmmm, it would have been better if we had seen some real benefit/evidence of Vicky and the group's distraction being vital.

                        Buffy re-activated that Chosen spell. So that means undoing it last issue was completely pointless. She didn't show any sort of new skills or powers in her battle against Ms. Wise that she couldn't have done as normal-Slayer-Buffy.
                        I thought the point was that she wasn't able to even hold her own against Wise until she had the amped up strength. So normal-Slayer-Buffy wouldn't have just come out scorched but would have been squished and not lasted long enough to have been fighting Wise with Spike (who would have been fried too) or then been able to keep Wise occupied whilst Willow fetched the dragon back.

                        Kinda lame that Faith got re-activated separately and offscreen. What was the point of that, why couldn't she get activated again along with Jordan, Satsu and the others? The activation spell should be an all-or-nothing thing.
                        I think we were led to think that there had been some debate about whether, with what had happened at the camp (and possibly also with Simone in S9), they were going to give the powers back to all the other slayers. But they wouldn't have had any doubt they were going to return it to Faith.

                        I wonder if the scythe's potential for being targeted as an item of power to be taken will be raised, or ignored like the Vampyr book is now.
                        Last edited by Stoney; 26-10-17, 07:50 AM.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Stoney View Post
                          I really would like to see Spike/Dru meet again in canon but I think the only potential angst they could go to there would be if she is getting dusted or they are arguing about looking to do so, which would work well to do following this season I think. As Spike turned away from Dru in S5, it would be odd for her to manage to create relationship angst just by being there I think
                          I can see some possible angst being mined from the story if Dru shows up, and Buffy wants to dust her for commiting some kind of attrocity (although I'd argue that Buffy could justify dusting her just for being there), and Spike instead wants to see her redeemed or rehabilitated. I think there is some potential for some real drama there, but I'd only want it if the writers were willing to go all-in, which we've seen over the last few seasons they prefer to play it safe. I'd want to see Spike and Buffy come to blows over Dru, with Buffy saying she's a lost cause, and Spike refusing to believe it because of his own redemption journey. Bring in Wood for maximum angst, and let Buffy see Spike's nastier side. Bring up Kendra. I'd want a situation where the audience thinks Buffy and Spike are willing to fight to the death over this. And I'd want a conclusion that doesn't end with Drusilla somehow slipping away again.

                          In short, I'd only want Drusilla back in BtVS if it's serious business, relationship-ending stuff. I wouldn't want her to show up, cause some surface level angst and jealously, only for it to end in an affirmation of the Buffy/Spike ship, while Drusilla is allowed to walk away.


                          Hmmm, it would have been better if we had seen some real benefit/evidence of Vicky and the group's distraction being vital.
                          Agreed. We should have seen something that benifited Buffy by keeping Vicky alive. I still don't get what the point was of Vicky not killing the people of that town. The false flag didn't make a lick of sense. It also completely went against the mythology when Buffy allowed Vicky to live when they had that confrontation under the bridge. I still cringe when I remember Buffy saying "if you didn't kill those people then you're not my enemy" or words to that effect. What about the people she's already killed, or people she may kill in the future? If Holden Webster or ressurected Darla didn't deserve the benefit of the doubt, then why did Vicky?

                          And as we've seen in this issue, Vicky is looking to kill again. What happened about the truce they declared with the New Vampires? Can they be killed on sight or not?



                          I thought the point was that she wasn't able to even hold her own against Wise until she had the amped up strength. So normal-Slayer-Buffy wouldn't have just come out scorched but would have been squished and not lasted long enough to have been fighting Wise with Spike (who would have been fried too) or then been able to keep Wise occupied whilst Willow fetched the dragon back.
                          That's the explanation we were told, not shown. Buffy throwing a car at her or something would have helped establish that yes, these increased Slayer powers are a big deal.

                          As it is, the issue could have easily been rewritten to not include the Slayer reversal spell. Just have Buffy and Faith both distract Wise while Willow fetches the dragon. It's not like being a turbo-Slayer actually beat Wise.

                          "But the purple energy blast would have incinerated Buffy if she was still a normal Slayer." Not if the writers didn't want it to, it wouldn't. Magic is always conveniently as strong as the writers need it to be. Spike survived the blast not because Buffy blocked part of it, not because he's an aged vampire with higher resistance but because he's a Named Character that the writers won't kill. The blast would have killed any random vampire, but because Spike is important, he just received superficial wounds. The blast would have superficially injured Buffy whether she was a turbo-Slayer, regular Slayer or even a depowered human.

                          If they'd shown the purple blast to open Buffy's guts, then she stuffs them back in her belly before she heals up like Wolverine, then yeah, I'd say the Slayer depowerment spell was narratively shown to be useful. Maybe during the fight she could have flashbacks to other Slayers, both past and present and use different signature moves that other Slayers have used to face off against whichever creatures power Ms. Wise was tapping into? Because it would have been cooler if Ms. Wise used a variety of supernatural powers instead of purple energy blasts and armour.

                          I don't think the Slayer depowerment spell was justified in the narrative. It seemed like a cheap way to (a) take Faith out of the fight, (b) make Wise superficially seem like a bigger threat and (c) have a reason for Jordan to come crawling back to Buffy and possibly make atonement.

                          Compare Buffy temporary upgrade here, to her upgrade when she fought against Adam. In season 4, the upgrade was completely justified and we saw Buffy doing new things in the fight she'd never done before, and that was on top of her symbolically combining her essence with Willow, Xander and Giles. We didn't just see her trade blows with Adam while being told "normal Buffy wouldn't survive that."

                          I think against Ms. Wise, we should have seen car-throwing, Wolverine-healing, Slayer-flashbacks and so forth. Or better still, just don't do the depowerment spell at all if you're just going to undo it next issue.

                          I think we were led to think that there had been some debate about whether, with what had happened at the camp (and possibly also with Simone in S9), they were going to give the powers back to all the other slayers. But they wouldn't have had any doubt they were going to return it to Faith.
                          Of course they'd give it back to Faith. I just find it a little weird that Buffy and Willow can re-empower the Slayers on an individual basis. Like, in Chosen, they didn't choose to empower only the girls in the Hellmouth, they empowered every Potential Slayer because that's just how the spell works. Likewise, last issue they drained every single Slayer -even if it would have been better to let Faith keep her powers, because that's how the spell (apparently) worked.

                          In this issue, it was mentioned they they'd given Faith her powers back -individually, offscreen which has never been a thing before.

                          Now, when Buffy and Willow gave Jordan and her crew her powers back, it presumably included all the former Slayers worldwide. Satsu, Leah, Kennedy, Nadira and probably Billy's mental connection to the Slayerline (as stupid as that is). If it was within their power to do so, Buffy and Willow should have excluded Dana from that list because she's crazy and denying her superpowers is better for the safety of everyone around her. But they didn't exclude Dana, because (in addition to the writers and editors probably not even remembering her) the Slayer activation spell isan all-or-nothing thing.

                          Faith was gonna get her powers back anyway when Jordan showed up this issue. Why screw with the mythology further by suggesting that Willlow and Buffy can re-ignite the Slayers individually?

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                          • #14
                            * Is Buffy immortal now? Is Spike not going to be creeped out when Buffy starts literally looking like his mother? Are Buffy and Spike going to end up in Heaven together? Is the flash-forward from AtF not going to happen i.e. Spike's being alive in the time of flying cars?

                            Darla was still in love with Angel over 100 years after 1900 C.E. If canon, Drusilla in IDW's Spike miniseries eagerly wanted to marry Spike.

                            Moreover, ANGEL IS STILL ALIVE!! It's very unlikely that Drusilla has caused enough death and damage since "Becoming Part II" (B 2.22) to outweigh all the death and damage Angel caused in Season 8.

                            Dracula is an ally of the Scoobies even after the stuff in BtVS S10.

                            I continue to find it troubling that some posters continue to want those like Harmony Kendall and Drusilla to die but are relatively fine with Angel's continuing to be alive.

                            In addition, Buffy didn't try to go after Harmony and didn't try to go after Drusilla at the end of "Crush" (B 5.14).

                            In addition, Drusilla is one of the most popular characters in the Buffyverse. Why kill her off? If she doesn't end up with Spike, the best solution is to try to make her good or simply reunite her with her family in heaven.

                            In any case, the comics are probably selling below 20K including all digital and TPBs. The millions of Buffy/Spike fans did not buy BtVS S10 and did not buy BtVS S11 even though Buffy and Spike were more together than ever. Angel's still alive and that been the biggest issue since BtVS 8.40.

                            I maintain that most of post-BtVS 8.40 should be scrapped and that's very likely the sentiment of most of the BtVS S8 readers who don't also want Angel's being Twilight to be scrapped.

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                            • #15
                              I think it's time for Dru to cross path with Spike - and Buffy. But I agree that for her to get away with murder again would be bad.

                              Unless someone came up with a really great story; I very much liked the one written by Gage in Angel & Faith; but not so much the one by Gischler, when Dru was misused, and shamefully ran away (barefoot, Victor has a thing for women without shoes!) in the end (but I want to add that I'm rereading A&F S10, and liking it a lot, it's just the last arc (the one with Dru) that was poorly written - but we know now that Victor was told to wrap it up earlier).

                              Things have changed again, if not radically, enough to make Vicki dust the next time she and Buffy meet; Harmony seems to be more interested in her "career", so she's safe.

                              Joanna Wise was a powerful opponent, and I think the power's transference made total sense; Buffy would be dead otherwise, and Spike's unlife being spared because of the Scythe was also plausible. And it was made in face of the urgency of the moment: they didn't expect such a powerful enemy (and Joanna also improvised, taking power from the dragon).

                              - - - Updated - - -

                              Originally posted by MikeB View Post
                              * Is Buffy immortal now? Is Spike not going to be creeped out when Buffy starts literally looking like his mother?
                              Was Willow creeped out when Tara got her brain sucked by Glory? Or did she stay with her no matter what? Love can turn into another kind, it still can be romantic and tender, but not sexual anymore. Spike could be creeped out - OR not. IF their relationship last enough to reach that point, that's an issue to deal in the farther future.
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