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Angel # 5 Issue Discussion Thread(Full Spoilers)

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  • Angel # 5 Issue Discussion Thread(Full Spoilers)

    Opening the thread for tomorrow's issue.

    Also writer Corinna Bechko will be doing a Q/A at Slayalive for this issue.

    One other thing,I'll post my thoughts for last issue when I post my thought's for this.Same with Buffy # 6 and tomorrow's # 7.

  • #2
    Things improved a lot in this issue, and the art is amazing.

    Angel and Fred are trapped aboard a ship - with the lovely couple Angelus and Darla - and they find out that the mysterious beetle in Angel’s vision could be related to a yet more mysterious and mystical and kind of alive jewelry (piece that interests Darla a great deal, too), kept by one of the sailors.

    Angel and Fred have to hurry, because the ship is supposed to be attacked by pirates soon, and then, she will end in the bottom of the ocean…

    But, as Fred said after Angel prevented the sailor to be killed by Darla, the future has changed, and in reality, Angel doesn’t know what will happen next anymore – which complicate things a lot.

    And if this near future has already irremediably changed, what about the far away future? This visit to the past in Season 11 may result in big changes; or, not. Which would make the whole thing pointless; I wonder how this will work out.

    I liked it, the voices of the characters seemed correct to me, and Angelus and Darla are always a good addition to the mix.
    My Tumblr: Dog is My Copilot

    Comment


    • #3
      I still find the voices in the previews really very awkward and clunky and the constant switching between Fred and Illyria an irritating writing choice. Then there is the whole time travelling where the ramifications feel really ill considered still. I will continue to keep an eye on the comments when these issues release, and I know I will get the trade eventually (completist and all that), but I really think this could be the worst of the comic season offerings so far by a whole heck of a lot.

      Nothing takes away from how incredible the cover for this issue is though. One of the best the comics have given.

      Comment


      • #4
        The Slayalive Q/A with Angel season 11 writer Corinna Bechko is running now.

        http://slayalive.com/showthread.php/...-11-5?p=124938

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Stoney View Post
          I still find the voices in the previews really very awkward and clunky and the constant switching between Fred and Illyria an irritating writing choice. Then there is the whole time travelling where the ramifications feel really ill considered still. I will continue to keep an eye on the comments when these issues release, and I know I will get the trade eventually (completist and all that), but I really think this could be the worst of the comic season offerings so far by a whole heck of a lot.

          Nothing takes away from how incredible the cover for this issue is though. One of the best the comics have given.
          The writing is terrible. I keep rolling my eyes at Angel talking about "Angelus" in the 3rd person. And now what, "Angelus" is going to be surprised at someone calling him "Angel"? Never mind that that's exactly what Darla, the Master, Dru, Spike and himself all called him throughout seasons 1 and 2, regardless of whether he had a soul or not? Or that "Angelus" is simply the Latin form of Angel, the nickname he took when his sister thought he was an angel returning to her from the dead, before he killed her?

          Did someone here mention earlier that this writer didn't even watch the shows?

          And the art is not any better - neither Fred nor Angel look anything like themselves. Angel generally fares poorly with comics art, but this time he looked like a 1950s rockabilly star. And Fred looked even less like Amy Acker.
          You keep waiting for the dust to settle and then you realize it; the dust is your life going on. If happy comes along - that weird unbearable delight that's actual happy - I think you have to grab it while you can. You take what you can get, 'cause it's here, and then...gone.

          Comment


          • #6
            So does anyone have some questions for the Q&A? It's super-awkward how nobody is asking any questions, and it looks like they will have to cut this Q&A short... I really think more of us should participate in the Q&A..

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Vampire in Rug View Post
              So does anyone have some questions for the Q&A? It's super-awkward how nobody is asking any questions, and it looks like they will have to cut this Q&A short... I really think more of us should participate in the Q&A..
              I normally do, even though I seem to constantly manage to confuse them and not get an answer to what I was trying to ask(!), but I've stopped reading these and so don't have something current to ask or something general that I can be certain wouldn't expose that I'm not up to date because the text has addressed it already, which would be pretty awkward too. That it's so quiet is sadly reflective of how they are being received.

              EDIT: I came up with a general writing question I could ask.
              Last edited by Stoney; 27-05-17, 01:27 PM.

              Comment


              • #8
                I've asked two questions.

                Comment


                • #9
                  This issue was actually the best in the Angel title this season -which admittedly isn't saying much. I do share TTBs complaints about Angel referring to "Angelus" in the third person, or his surprise at being called "Angel". I would have liked the series to spend more time onboard the ship rather than that dull storyline in the Primordial Era -seriously what was the point of that arc? It's great to see Darla again. The artwork is a little different, but I don't mind it.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    The previous issue was better, the voices sounded more like the characters and we had the promise of getting out of Illyria's past, so I was looking forward to #5, thinking that finally the season was improving. But this issue was such a dissapointment. Apart from the front cover, there is nothing good here. The story is meandering, and I have no idea where it's going, or why Angel is even here. How does this tie in with the previous 4 issues? There doesn't seem to be a through-line for the audience to follow. The writing is dull, none of the lines stick in your mind and I just don't recognise Fred or Angel from these characterisations. Sorry that my first post here is so negative, I'll try and do better next time

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Priceless View Post
                      The previous issue was better, the voices sounded more like the characters and we had the promise of getting out of Illyria's past, so I was looking forward to #5, thinking that finally the season was improving. But this issue was such a dissapointment. Apart from the front cover, there is nothing good here. The story is meandering, and I have no idea where it's going, or why Angel is even here. How does this tie in with the previous 4 issues? There doesn't seem to be a through-line for the audience to follow. The writing is dull, none of the lines stick in your mind and I just don't recognise Fred or Angel from these characterisations. Sorry that my first post here is so negative, I'll try and do better next time
                      You certainly are under no obligation to only post positive thoughts.

                      I'm in a position I haven't been in before (well since S9, I joined fandom after S8 completed), because I stopped reading the issues of the Angel title as they are released. As I've said, I'll definitely get them all when the TPBs come out, but hearing people's honest reactions as the series progresses helps me hugely. Not just in keeping a little up to date with the developments even though I'm not reading, but also because if it suddenly improved hugely, or a major development occurred, I might go back to getting the digitals too rather than waiting to buy the hard copies.

                      Corinna had said something in the previous Q&A about different sides to the characters Fred/Illyria, Angel/Angelus and how people change from who they were with experience and time anyway, or something like that. So perhaps these trips through time are supposed to be giving some kind of overview of the two characters in who they have been in a way that is going to be tied up by the season end against who they are now, or where they feel they want to go next.

                      Obviously that kind of consideration is always pertinent to characters in progressive stories, rather than more static heroes like Batman for example, but it has been more the focus in BtVS I think. Not that Angel isn't on an overall path, but he is more often shown regressing or repeating the same mistakes perhaps. A lot of his focus is on looking back as he tries to redeem himself from his past acts, but maybe in a way that often limits his willingness or ability to look forward.

                      Does anyone feel that the flicking between Fred/Illyria mid conversations has improved? This was one of the most off-putting aspects in the writing for me, I found it really awkward and increasingly irritating.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Of all the things to complain about I don't get the name thing. While they embody the same...body, in the general sense on both shows Angelus = Soulless Angel and Angel = Soulled Angel.

                        It does seem like the whole primordial arc was completely pointless. So far it seems to conflict with this one. When Angel saved the traveler, he should no longer have had the memory of Angelus eating him as the past arc showed that they actions had an immediate effect on the future.

                        This whole story feels useless, like the whole purpose is to get Angel out of the way. Not that they need to, but that's what it feels like.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I disagree that this issue was worse than the last. This writer has the worst characterization for Illyria ever, so the fact that she wasn't in this issue much already puts it above the last few. The Primordiam era stuff was completely pointless and could have been easily condensed down into one issue.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by HardlyThere View Post
                            Of all the things to complain about I don't get the name thing. While they embody the same...body, in the general sense on both shows Angelus = Soulless Angel and Angel = Soulled Angel.

                            It does seem like the whole primordial arc was completely pointless. So far it seems to conflict with this one. When Angel saved the traveler, he should no longer have had the memory of Angelus eating him as the past arc showed that they actions had an immediate effect on the future.

                            This whole story feels useless, like the whole purpose is to get Angel out of the way. Not that they need to, but that's what it feels like.
                            There is no "they". It's the same person. He never talked about himself without soul in 3rd person as some other dude, or vice versa.
                            And as for the name thing, he was called Angel most of the time for the first 2 and a half seasons of BtVS, and Darla, Dru, Spike, the Master all called him "Angel" even when he didn't have a soul, so unless we are going to erase the first 2 seasons of BtVS from canon, "Angelus" really should not be surprised when someone calls him "Angel".
                            You keep waiting for the dust to settle and then you realize it; the dust is your life going on. If happy comes along - that weird unbearable delight that's actual happy - I think you have to grab it while you can. You take what you can get, 'cause it's here, and then...gone.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              You could be right, and perhaps the writer wanted to give an overview of Fred/Illyria and Angel, but I'm not sure that was necessary. I would rather learn about these characters by moving forwards, not interrogating the past. But then I've never been a fan of Illyria and her history doesn't interest me at all, and I think we have seen enough of Angel's past to question what new things can we possibly learn.

                              In this issue there was very little (if any) Illyria, so no switching between her and Fred, which I agree does get a bit annoying.

                              - - - Updated - - -

                              This issue was the worst for me because i was expecting so much more. The cover art was so good and I hoped for an interesting Darla/Angelus story, and felt very let down. I agree, the Illyria stuff was pointless, I wasn't a fan of Illyria at all, and wish they'd spent the first four issues somewhere else

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