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Buffy # 28 Issue Disussion thread(Full Spoilers)

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  • Buffy # 28 Issue Disussion thread(Full Spoilers)

    The issue is out tomorrow.Bringing over that first review from a few days ago.

    http://www.wickedhorror.com/horror-r...ire-slayer-28/

    Comic Review: Buffy the Vampire Slayer #28

    June 16, 2016By Nat Brehmer

    I know of several fans who stopped reading the comic because of something they were certain was going to happen in this issue. So, obviously, there’s no way to avoid spoilers because we’re going to address that topic pretty openly. The last issue ended with Spike telling Buffy that he thought it would be best if they broke up. Now, Buffy fans take their shipping very, very seriously. And people have dreamed of Buffy and Spike as an actual, healthy couple for a long time. For over ten years, in fact. To actually see this in the comic book, to finally have that relationship be validated on such an amazing scale, I understand why they feel everything so deeply. I really do.

    But I also love the way this issue plays with certain expectations. We’re not used to happiness in the Buffy universe. It’s not something that tends to stick around. Healthy couples don’t usually get to stay healthy or even together for very long, especially couples that either Buffy or Spike are a part of. That’s not to mention the fact that when Buffy and Spike were initially put together way back when, the relationship was very pointedly toxic. But they were different people then. And that, really, is what this issue is all about.



    What happens is that Spike tells Buffy that it would be so much easier if they broke up now in order to avoid hurting each other even more later on, and Buffy tells him “No.” Now, just reading that at first might sound bad, because it’s generally considered bad form if you don’t just let someone break up with you. But everything that follows her saying that is kind of beautiful.

    The bulk of this issue is a genuinely adult conversation about conducting adult relationships. It is, in essence, the story of Buffy and Spike and everything that brought them to this point. Of course it would be easier to call it quits, but the easiest thing is very seldom the best thing to do when you love someone. They’ve both had their share of troubles in past relationships, especially with each other, and they acknowledge that. Buffy is frankly glad to hear he’s having doubts and admits that she has her own and that that’s the healthy thing to do. Have doubts. Talk through them and be stronger for doing so.

    And Spike, God bless him, acknowledges the unhealthy way he obsessed over Buffy. He talks about how he put her on a pedestal and is perfectly self-aware without taking us out of the moment. He throws away the notion of Buffy, the goddess he worshipped for so long. Spike finally discards that and focuses on Buffy the woman. She’s flawed and he’s flawed and they both love each other for it and that’s a place I’ve been rooting for these characters to reach for a long, long time.



    But the issue is not solely devoted to Buffy and Spike by any means. Dawn and Xander have an incredible journey home, an adventure that’s probably an epic in its own right but that we see just the right fleeting moments of in order to be totally satisfied with. As friends or romantic partners, the trust and strength they find in each other is incredible. I know not everyone loves the arc Dawn has taken this season, but I do.

    I’m in the vocal minority, but Dawn has always been one of my favorite characters. And while I love the comics, she definitely got the short end of the stick in terms of characterization in both season eight and season nine. Things happened to her and other people had to solve them and fix them. In this arc, Dawn has found an incredible strength and she’s found herself lost. But now she’s not only using that strength, she’s relying on her own largely untapped wit and intelligence to navigate her way through Hell and back to Earth, with only Xander’s trust and support in her as her guide. Plus, in the middle of all of this, we finally get to see the world of nothing but shrimp.

    Willow, too, also has some nice moments as she realizes that while she doesn’t disagree with the reasons she chose to work alongside the military, they will always have a different agenda. Andrew, too, also comes to terms with some incredibly important things about himself.

    In general, this is a beamingly positive issue, overall. Yes, that probably means something bad is going to happen and as we head into the final two issues of the season it’s clear that the gang are in for a hell of a fight. But for basically the first time this season, I am certain that whatever is coming, they can kick its ass. This group is back and working as a unit again and they are doing it in a way that feels not only earned, but necessary. Whatever they’ve done, even if they’ve never been a truly core part of the group, they are now. If anything ever made Andrew’s place in the ensemble official, this is it.

    If people have abandoned ship—pardon the pun—I’d advise them to hop back on board, because season 10 is drawing toward a really promising close that leaves me more excited for the upcoming season than I’ve ever been.

    WICKED RATING: 8 Stars (8 / 10)

  • #2
    I'm one of those who stepped away from the comic for a time even though I've continued to collect them.

    If the Spuffy is really going to be wrapped up neatly with a bow - then Spike will probably lose his soul and run off with Drusilla or the whole relationship will be retconned by someone writing in the book, wiping out the time line from Angel in a wrestling mask as Twilight to RoboPreggersBuffy to the bizarrely OOC Spuffy relationship where their last moments in the Hellmouth in Chosen never seem to have happened.

    The comic's gotten so far from the show that it wouldn't surprise me if Whedon just used the book to reboot the entire series over again from Season One. Or Spike shanshus and becomes human and loses his memory. Or maybe we'll find that the whole Buffyverse took place in a snowglobe.

    Anyhoo, I really hope that Willow gets a bigger part in the storyline next season. And if Spike and Buffy do stay together, can the comic let them stay contented with each other (same for Xander and Dawn) and get past all the romantic angst so that we can get some REAL plot going in Season 11 with GREAT villains and thought-provoking DRAMA? Please???
    Last edited by American Aurora; 22-06-16, 01:38 AM.

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    • #3
      I'll see your St. Elsewhere and raise you a Newhart. Kristy Swanson's Buffy wakes up and tells Luke Perry's Pike about an awful dream where she re-lived her high school and college years.

      I had thought about how the book could be used to wipe out the comics continuity so they can head to reunion TV specials without the burden of robot pregnancies, Mexican wrestling masks, etc. But you're right, it could be used to introduce that long-threatened reboot.

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      • #4
        Well, I liked the issue, a lot. I refuse to give in to the cynicism! This issue delivered a Buffy I recognised - ' I really don't have time for your nonsense, lets work the problem and everything else will come along'. Okay, the Spike is bizarre (giving up on a relationship?? Spike?? Really??) but he has given us a real Buffy so, yay!!

        I loved the Dawn and Xander Odyssey and Andrew was a delight. I'm not overly happy with Willow just cutting out on Lake (and vice versa), but there is plenty of time for Lake to come over to the Scooby side, so maybe that will be satisfactory too.

        Okay maybe Gage is a crowd pleaser, but soooo what? It is all making sense for me. If they can settle down the relationship nonsense there is so much story that can be told.

        I'm a fan. I'll give them my $5.99

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        • #5
          Since Lake barely constitutes a "character", don't really mind one way or another if she's gone. She was just something for Willow to do (that means two things). I don't remember the name of Andrew's boyfriend at all, but he has at least shown more human depth.

          You've got to dodge anvils left, right, and center with the Spuffy flow, but the break-up as a red herring rates zero on the surprise-o-meter. There was definitely a lot (maybe too much) of a Take That! baked into Buffy's discourse, basically her channeling her writers, talking through the fourth wall, and telling people to take endless pedant over what she needs in a relationship and why they go wrong and shove it up our collective asses. It's nice to see Buffy -- even though this is hardly the relationship I'd have ever written for her -- boil down to the simple "I want to be with you, and nothing more complicated needs to be solved right now" core of a relationship. And that, too, runs parallel with Xander and Dawn, who I kinda hope are reigniting over the course of this journey, and with whom Xander summarizes perfectly the essential contract (and in so doing kind of articulates Buffy's case for her and Spike as well) -- "lean on me. And I'll lean on you."

          I like the essential gravity that pulls all these characters back together. kamw is right, it's a bit "crowd-pleasing", but, hey, the crowd are after all paying customers and this is a season finale we're rolling up on. I also like the Act I of "The Gift" like quality of the plan coming together, where the characters (or in this case just Buffy and Spike) are hip to it, but we haven't gotten read in yet. Remember, back then it was the Buffybot as the way for Buffy to get a drop on Glory; here, they must have some idea that bypasses D'Hoffryn's defenses or just otherwise exploits his basic assumptions about them and the world he means to rule. Since it's only being kept in their pocket for one issue (back then for one commercial break), it's not irksome, it actually is building some anticipation.
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          • #6
            Originally posted by American Aurora View Post
            I'm one of those who stepped away from the comic for a time even though I've continued to collect them.

            If the Spuffy is really going to be wrapped up neatly with a bow - then Spike will probably lose his soul and run off with Drusilla or the whole relationship will be retconned by someone writing in the book, wiping out the time line from Angel in a wrestling mask as Twilight to RoboPreggersBuffy to the bizarrely OOC Spuffy relationship where their last moments in the Hellmouth in Chosen never seem to have happened.

            The comic's gotten so far from the show that it wouldn't surprise me if Whedon just used the book to reboot the entire series over again from Season One. Or Spike shanshus and becomes human and loses his memory. Or maybe we'll find that the whole Buffyverse took place in a snowglobe.

            Anyhoo, I really hope that Willow gets a bigger part in the storyline next season. And if Spike and Buffy do stay together, can the comic let them stay contented with each other (same for Xander and Dawn) and get past all the romantic angst so that we can get some REAL plot going in Season 11 with GREAT villains and thought-provoking DRAMA? Please???
            In what way do you think Chosen is being ignored?

            I feel like the chances of Spike losing his soul this season, or being sucked off to an alt dimension or some such, whilst still plausible, feel less likely to me having read this issue. It does seem like they have wanted to draw a line in the relationship angst and that is what Spuffy has been about this season. I really hope so, as you know I find the predictable pain/break ups unrealistic and tedious writing. So I'm happy to roll with what they have done with them this season even if the dramatic plotting of it has been lacking. Basically they seem to have looked to put them together, air past issues, directly deal with Angel 'knowing' and now are looking to outright say they are moving on from it all into giving it all a fresh go. So yeah, let them just be a couple and turn the focus back on the group and the monsters they all fight.

            Originally posted by kamw30 View Post
            Well, I liked the issue, a lot. I refuse to give in to the cynicism! This issue delivered a Buffy I recognised - ' I really don't have time for your nonsense, lets work the problem and everything else will come along'. Okay, the Spike is bizarre (giving up on a relationship?? Spike?? Really??) but he has given us a real Buffy so, yay!
            I think with Spike you can just look on it and see his insecurities flaring. Gage writes Spike pretty true to BtVS S7 I think and him worrying how he might mess up and wondering if he should stay away is hardly a new angle for him. You have to remember that Spike is a big drama queen and taking chances, making big gestures, looking to change things for himself is one thing, getting the day to day ins and outs (no dirty pun intended) of a relationship right and not fearing being found wanting is something that we haven't seen him face souled before. The characters can't stay static and this is new ground for him it is fair that it generates slightly surprising responses and they are working with established and retouched upon insecurities so it is fair enough I think.

            I still am expecting there will be something 'bad' happen within the finale, but A&F was massively underwhelming in that sense so perhaps not. But I won't be surprised if S10 works essentially for establishing the current group dynamics to continue on from here. I could see a season successfully following this where the plot is more the focus, this really does feel a lot like the setting shift that S4 achieved. I still think the rough sweeps of how the characters got from the show to here works progressively for them.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Stoney View Post
              So yeah, let them just be a couple and turn the focus back on the group and the monsters they all fight.
              Of course, being a Spuffy I'm biased, but I believe that is the solution to put an end to the endless drama that Buffy's love life is and focus on the core Scoobies, monsters, fighting etc...
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              • #8
                I liked it, too. I mean, I'm in the crowd and now I'm pleased, so...

                I still think the whole Spike-pedestaling-Buffy thing seems a bit off. He once said, "I've seen the best and the worst of you." And I would like to see Season 11 go forward with a more interesting plot and less relationship drama. Everything coming together with friendship has been pretty predictable and I'm ready to move past it. That said, I'm pretty excited to see how they're gonna do the finale, and I haven't looked forward to a new issue before this one in a while, so they must be doing something right.

                Buffy was awesome, she felt like Buffy and I loved her. I also loved Dawn and Xander. I can't believe I am actually rooting for this ship! But Dawn has been a standout for me the whole season, ever since she stood up to their dad.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by kimothyschma View Post
                  I still think the whole Spike-pedestaling-Buffy thing seems a bit off. He once said, "I've seen the best and the worst of you."
                  It can be interpreted as Spike seeing the best and the worst of Buffy, but still thinking that she could do no wrong - like many people kept saying (not me) that he was her lap dog, and followed her in every decision. Does that make sense?
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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by betta View Post
                    It can be interpreted as Spike seeing the best and the worst of Buffy, but still thinking that she could do no wrong - like many people kept saying (not me) that he was her lap dog, and followed her in every decision. Does that make sense?
                    Yeah, it does. I don't think it's totally out of left field. He never really questioned any of her decisions until now. But he was witness to a lot of her lowest moments, not least beating the crap out of him in DT. But that was before the soul, so he could be excusing it. I still think he's "slightly off" in this season, even though it's working for others. But then again I haven't really taken the time to figure out what is bothering me exactly. But it's what I've been feeling all season. I could live with it more if I think about it as he's putting what it would be like to be in a relationship with Buffy on the pedestal, rather than Buffy herself. KWIM?

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                    • #11
                      I think Spike has always constantly questioned Buffy's decisions as enemies, allies, lovers, friends. But yes, I do think the thing to remember here and now is that trying to have an healthy souled relationship is something totally new for Spike. He is figuring out the relationship stuff to a great extent and I don't think he is talking about that or putting Buffy on a pedestal so much as what has disrupted things from his pov. He has his own hang ups and insecurities that plague him about still being a monster and he had needed to have an inspirational character to his souled self and she became this beacon that was not about her as a person but ideas and wants for himself represented. He is trying to live a new life this season where he isn't totally focussing on his love interest but is trying to belong and live a life out of the dark and all of this flows from his S9. It is easy to fall in the trap of seeing a character as being odd, ooc or some such because they are changing and yet isn't that what we wish for them too?? I'm not sure I'm making sense, I must need more wine.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by PuckRobin View Post
                        I'll see your St. Elsewhere and raise you a Newhart. Kristy Swanson's Buffy wakes up and tells Luke Perry's Pike about an awful dream where she re-lived her high school and college years.

                        I had thought about how the book could be used to wipe out the comics continuity so they can head to reunion TV specials without the burden of robot pregnancies, Mexican wrestling masks, etc. But you're right, it could be used to introduce that long-threatened reboot.
                        Problem is a reboot doesn't really fix anything. All the detritus of 3 seasons of fail are still stuck with the reader. Take Cordy in S4. Mentally, they fix it: it wasn't her. Emotionally, the switch has been flicked on the character. Same thing here. The stink of Twilight and all the retcons is still there. The only way to fix it is if they go total Roseanne finale and they don't have the guts.

                        I broke down and read this issue after someone I trust liked it and it's quite good to see someone resembling Buffy from the TV show again. But where was she for 100+ issues? There is no trust left between the character, writer and reader.

                        I agree there are Gift similarities. We know how that ended, though, and if it was Joss the whole "put it off till later" would have warning bells ringing. Gage? Someone might stub their toe.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Stoney View Post
                          It is easy to fall in the trap of seeing a character as being odd, ooc or some such because they are changing and yet isn't that what we wish for them too?? I'm not sure I'm making sense, I must need more wine.
                          Someone else already pointed out (and I agree) that "this character would never do that, ever!" isn't valid, because people change, mature, and yes, they sometimes react differently to the same situations they had already been through in the past. Imagine a vampire who got his soul back - Spike is still Spike, IMO, but of course he changed and his reactions are not the same as when he was a soulless being. Before, he loved Buffy and accepted anything and everything from her; now, he still loves her, but things have changed.
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                          • #14
                            My overall thoughts on the issue...

                            I enjoyed it, there was a good sense of build up heading towards the last two issues and I like the tease of not knowing about the plan yet. As other people have suggested I agree that we could still yet see other characters drawn across or out of the woodwork for the fight.

                            I'm hoping that Buffy and Spike are left to just get on with being a couple for a time now and we get more focus on the wider plot for S11 and the changes within the gang that are unfolding. Spike's declaration hopefully means that he will get a little more fire in taking Buffy on some of the times she is unfair in the blows she administers. I appreciate the recent viciousness was reactive to the stress of the situation on her part and he has been feeling uncertain how to have a healthy relationship and deal with his own insecurities etc. But an equal functioning relationship is one where he isn't waiting for the shoe to drop for her all the time and fears triggering it. Whilst soul loss (not his story angle imo) or dimension slips are possible hiccups that could still be thrown in, I hope we didn't navigate around the tedium of constant relationship fail just to head into deliberate angst drama instead. Seeing a couple working through the tough times and seeing if it will work alongside everything else they have going on is far more relatable to me and would be a progressive step I'd welcome BtVS finally taking. It could play very interestingly against Giles' situation and drama as he is forced backwards through his physical adolescence.

                            Buffy/Spike contrasted well against Willow/Lake which seems to have just folded. I had felt that there was real value in seeing one of the gang choose to take a different path but I can't say I'm surprised the writers didn't stick with that and Willow wanted to return 'home'. Clive gave us the focus of the wider context which has been at play in most of these relationships this season and the pressures being put on them and happening around them. Some are ones to address and deal with and with others, such as the opinion spouting we have been getting and manipulations, you have to consider the wider contexts at play. But as D'Hoffryn made clear and Clive backed up, avoidance doesn't work.

                            The influence of Dr Mike has drifted through dimensions with Xander as the proactive approach and appears to still have been about positive personal development. Where everything with Anya and Jonathan is going to go still feels more unknown but this repeated aspect of having presence and body, essentially mattering and using people's fears, wants and insecurities to use them remains with both. This aspect was raised in the dimension shifts for Dawn too, about mattering and being 'real'. Again the context of interactions with, and responses to, others feels key around all of these. I'm glad Dawn and Xander are back and it will be interesting to get an idea how long it was for them hopefully and see what has changed in their dynamic and for them individually from the experience. Interesting stuff going forward from here.

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                            • #15
                              http://www.ign.com/articles/2016/06/...22-2016?page=3

                              Buffy the Vampire Slayer: Season 10 #28

                              Written by Christos Gage | Drawn by Rebekah Isaacs

                              Yes, the Buffy-verse is all about friendship, family, and love. Buffy stories are often at their strongest when they are dealing with those issues and addressing real world relationships in the context of monster battles. But it all starts to lose its impact when it’s so heavily leaned on, so often. This issue is yet another examination of each group member’s feelings separately, as they slowly all drift back together. The problem is, we’ve seen this same story several times over the course of season 10. Part of that problem is - just how long is this season supposed to go on?!? It feels like we’ve built up to a season finale level event three times already. Frustratingly, this is also yet another issue that doesn’t make good enough use of the medium or Rebekah Isaacs’ wonderful skills by being too “talky”. This is just the latest frustration in what’s proving to be Buffy’s most frustrating season to date.–Levi

                              Final Score:

                              5.0


                              I probably won't get my copy until the weekend.

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