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Regarding Buffy/Spike continuing after the AR:

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  • Regarding Buffy/Spike continuing after the AR:

    This is being discussed in the BtVS 10.20 thread and this is my response:

    * Buffy and Angel would have been having sex with each other in BtVS S3 and Buffy/Parker and Buffy/Riley almost certainly would have never happened if the perfect happiness clause was gone and not coming back and Buffy and Angel knew that.

    If “I Will Remember You” (A 1.08) actually happened and wasn’t simply in Angel’s mind (put there by the PTB and/or Jasmine), Buffy and Angel had sex with each other around 1.5 years after “Becoming Part II” (B 2.22).

    Uncursed Angel’s actions in BtVS S2 are much more lasting, traumatizing, and ‘significant’ than the AR of “Seeing Red” (B 6.19).

    If Spike in BtVS S7 wasn’t forcing Buffy to have a platonic relationship with him, Buffy and Spike would have been having sex with each other sooner than they actually did and as-is likely were having sex after “Get It Done” (B 7.15).

    If Buffy and Spike weren’t having sex with each other sometime after BtVS 8.39, the first time Buffy and Spike have sex with each other (BtVS 10.12) is from 3-11 years after “Chosen” (B 7.22).

    Any notion regarding Buffy/Spike wouldn’t have continued after “Seeing Red” (B 6.19) is unreasonable and any notion regarding Buffy and Spike ‘rushed into sex’ in BtVS 10.12 is beyond silly.

    Buffy’s been in love with Spike since sometime during BtVS S6 at latest and the actual problem with Season 10 regarding Buffy/Spike is it seems to act as if BtVS S7 never happened, that the AR is somehow comparable to Angel’s BtVS S8 actions, and that Angel regarding BtVS S8 is pretty much only responsible for killing Giles.

    We’ve yet to see Buffy and Spike dance together, go on a romantic date, actually fully cohabitate, etc. Outside of their holding hands, their BtVS S10 relationship is in ways less than what it was in BtVS S7.


    * Regarding the AR, Spike got his soul back partly as an ‘apology’ to Buffy. The AR was dealt with much more seriously than Uncursed Angel was, than pretty much any of Xander’s wrongdoings, and arguably any of Giles’s wrongdoings.

    [The AR has] been a big deal to the audience,
    It seems at least most of the viewers had a problem with the writers having Spike attempt to rape Buffy. I don’t recall a single interview about the upcoming BtVS S7 in which anyone (aside from possibly Sarah Michelle Gellar, James Marsters, and Nicholas Brendan) not being excited about Buffy/Spike continuing in BtVS S7. Tara’s death was a much bigger issue for viewers to the point that many Willow/Tara fans simply didn’t watch BtVS S7. The popularity of Buffy/Spike didn’t take a significant hit after “Seeing Red” (B 6.19).

    * “Lessons” (B 7.01) through “Get it Done” (B 7.15) deals with the ‘fallout’ of how the Buffy/Spike was in BtVS S6 albeit it’s mostly about Spike’s feelings regarding whether Buffy and he can be much more than mere lovers and confidants and such. Buffy’s main problem regarding Buffy/Spike lasted from “Beneath You” (B 7.02) through “Sleeper” (B 7.08) but was mainly about how Spike was acting around her and about the implications of his getting his soul back.

    Nobody's been able to do more than argue for all that time that it should be a pretty big issue between them
    Buffy in “I Only Have Eyes for You” (B 1.19) was hopeful that ‘her’ Angel was back. Buffy during the summer after BtVS S2 was dreaming romantic dreams of Buffy/Angel.

    Buffy in “Same Time, Same Place” (B 7.03) fully forgave Willow regarding Willow’s BtVS S6 actions.

    Buffy in “Once More With Feeling” (B 6.07) literally was going to burn herself to death so that she could be the bride of ‘The Devil’ in a hell dimension. There was zero fallout regarding Xander’s actions in “Once More With Feeling”.

    From Buffy’s perspective, Spike was horrified that he almost raped Buffy, he ‘went away’ because he knew the AR was wrong, he got his soul back largely as an apology to Buffy, etc.

    American Aurora

    * No sex between Buffy/Spike has been “disastrous”.

    * Attempted rape is not the same as rape. Spike never raped Buffy.

    If [the AR] means something, then [Buffy/Spike’s] violent and troubled relationship (and that means Buffy as well) should have been the first thing that Buffy dealt with before initiating a sexual relationship.
    Did you forget “Lessons” (B 7.01) through “Never Leave Me” (B 7.09)?