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Angel & Faith # 21 Issue Discussion Thread(Full Spoilers)

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  • Angel & Faith # 21 Issue Discussion Thread(Full Spoilers)

    The new issue is out tomorrow.

  • #2
    No one has read it? I'm curious if it's even worth downloading.

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    • #3
      I won't get my issue until probably the weekend.I did see some reactions over at Slayalive and it sounds like the issue does have some big reveals in it.
      Last edited by BAF; 03-12-15, 09:32 PM.

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      • #4
        Just caught up with last issue and this one. I liked Nadira's fierce ownership of her slayer side in the last issue but I can't even begin to express how disappointing Dru remains for me. She may as well be an entirely different character her voice is just so totally lacking.

        I appreciated Angel's caution after the events in SF at the end of #20 but it quickly came across as being too much and his leadership pull on Faith in this issue as reactive and defensive about feeling uncertain of facing Archaeus again. I know they were emphasising his uncertainty in his conversation with Faith to draw attention to his current team and the risk of the demon family he is part of too, but I found him talking about gaining Faith to work with as a change from dealing with things alone odd as his story has always in part been about accepting help from those around him and needing those human connections. But I thought Angel referencing his connection to Spike being what saved him last time was interesting as it still drew on his connection to his vampire family and then sat against the deliberate emphasis of Faith saying she had his back here/now and him talking about them as his team when they went back inside. Obviously with the arc titling it is going to be played as the two sides and it will be interesting to see how the magic town magic fits in as it certainly feels like the loose canon.

        The family links were all over the place with Faith's reference to Giles too and Archaeus outright stating he wanted to give himself a patriarchal role. I found it really weird hearing Angel referred to as Dru's brother though. This attempt at breaking apart the sire relationship that Archaeus' strong hold through his contributing demon essence is doing is a mythology shift that I don't like much. I don't have a problem with the notion of the demon essence coming from a specific demon that is consciously contributing to a siring process and has an ongoing, individual link, but the writing seems to be undermining the actual siring vampire's role and the bond they share with their progeny.

        We also had another reference to Spike in Archaeus' mention of retrieving him which made me feel even more sure that Dru at least is going to end up over in SF for the end of the season. I've liked having the crossover story but at the same time these mentions and the likely crossover again for the end in the main title make me feel wary that it won't feel strong overall and tied together but just too disjointed across the two. I would expect that Archaeus will get defeated in A&F, but it could just be the magic town/statue are the end of season here and he also heads back to SF for a final showdown there. There was a reference to being a real boy in the last issue I think it was and that seems to link alongside Spike's issues with the monster he still is and with the connection that Archaeus is able to try and exploit. So perhaps both vamps will have the thought/opportunity to become human as a way to resolve this and disconnect from the demon influence and that would have Archaeus crossing over again too. Who knows, there are plenty of possibilities but I hope the overall effect isn't that both titles feel like they were just meandering between all these links if it all comes together at the end. Also, I have to say that there still isn't anything to indicate why Angel, Dru and Spike specifically matter so much to Archaeus really. Why not just gather a hoard of vampires together and instead go to so much angst to get three specific ones? I want a reason and coupled with the siring dilution and Archeaus' mwhaha tendencies I'm just not loving his character/story.

        I expect that Angel's evil turn is a fake out, it was just way too predictable. The reveal of Brandt being vamped however was unexpected and I appreciated it for making the bad guys seem threatening for a change. It is a pretty logical move to gain the advantage by turning one of those who can give them insight/info, even if the advantage is short lived. I'm assuming that it was a relatively recent incident.

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        • #5
          Thanks for teh review. Archaeus heading back to SF would be disappointing as hell. He's just a cheesy villain and moreover, there is too much going on there as it is. The last thing that story needs is more characters.

          I still harbor the suspicion that killing Archaeus is going to turn Angel, Spike and Dru human.

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          • #6
            Okay, I read it! I'm pretty much with Stoney on all counts.

            Evil vampire quipping game: abysmal – some really, really bad lines.

            Shallow observation of the issue: I miss Dru’s goth french mani

            Fred: I've come to the conclusion that I loved Fred because of Amy Acker's incredibly endearing performance. I can no longer care about this character at all, and I'm ready to have Illyria back.

            Brandt: Great twist, I was shocked!

            Angel: He’s faking.

            Angel & Faith: I agree with Stoney, the fight was not great, a little forced so we could get to the Make-up Scene of Psychological Exposition. Angel's used to being alone? That’s his own fault. He has tons of people trying to help him all the time. Did he forget about the Fang Gang? I did like the part where he admitted to resenting her leaving “deep down.” I could imagine DB delivering that line in that adorably grumpy way of his.

            Angel & Dru: This was my favorite part of the issue and is peak Dru so far in the season. I agree that her voice has been pretty bad so far; this is the first time I could hear Juliet Landau in my head.

            Archaeus: Over him. But the scene with him and Angel and Dru was not the worst he's ever been. But yeah, weird when he called himself Drusilla's father and Angel her brother. Join me! And together we can rule the galaxy – er, magic town! – as father and son!

            Overall: I probably enjoyed this one more than any other A&F this season! Things are finally happening!

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            • #7
              This whole season has been very mediocre and full of filler. All the crap with Kennedy and DeepScan, did that lead anywhere? Weren't DeepScan supposed to be studying Fred and Illyria?

              Season 9 set up Magic Town really well, it could have been awesome. Instead, we've got no idea what makes Magic Town any different from the rest of the world. Why is Archaeus keeping Nadira alive? I get that he needs her to communicate with Magic Town, but why doesn't he sire her?

              The reveal with Brandt at the end was pretty cool. I wish they'd actually built him into an actual character first, instead of an exposition guy. He could have had a romance with Faith or something, would have made him getting sired even more tragic. Oh well, Brandt is still better than the cardboard cut-out "character" that is Dowling.

              I hope its actual Angelus at the end. For starters, Drusilla should be able to tell the difference if he was faking it. Or at least one of the lackeys should be able to sense his soul (if the writers bother the remember that piece of the mythology). If he's not faking it, I'm guessing his soul has gone "dormant" like that time he got his drink spiked, rather than actually gone to the afterlife or into a jar like the other two times he's lost his soul. Although if his soul is actually gone, it could be a good reason why the A&F book is shorter this season than the BtVS book. Maybe at the end of the season they have to go back to SF for Willow to restore Angel's soul. Although that's something that should probably happen in A&F rather than BtVS, especially since Alistair has done pretty much nothing this season.

              MikeB is gonna hate Drusilla getting roughed up and ordered around by Archaeus.

              - - - Updated - - -

              This whole season has been very mediocre and full of filler. All the crap with Kennedy and DeepScan, did that lead anywhere? Weren't DeepScan supposed to be studying Fred and Illyria?

              Season 9 set up Magic Town really well, it could have been awesome. Instead, we've got no idea what makes Magic Town any different from the rest of the world. Why is Archaeus keeping Nadira alive? I get that he needs her to communicate with Magic Town, but why doesn't he sire her?

              The reveal with Brandt at the end was pretty cool. I wish they'd actually built him into an actual character first, instead of an exposition guy. He could have had a romance with Faith or something, would have made him getting sired even more tragic. Oh well, Brandt is still better than the cardboard cut-out "character" that is Dowling.

              I hope its actual Angelus at the end. For starters, Drusilla should be able to tell the difference if he was faking it. Or at least one of the lackeys should be able to sense his soul (if the writers bother the remember that piece of the mythology). If he's not faking it, I'm guessing his soul has gone "dormant" like that time he got his drink spiked, rather than actually gone to the afterlife or into a jar like the other two times he's lost his soul. Although if his soul is actually gone, it could be a good reason why the A&F book is shorter this season than the BtVS book. Maybe at the end of the season they have to go back to SF for Willow to restore Angel's soul. Although that's something that should probably happen in A&F rather than BtVS, especially since Alistair has done pretty much nothing this season.

              MikeB is gonna hate Drusilla getting roughed up and ordered around by Archaeus.

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              • #8
                Read it. I don't know which would be worse, that he's faking or that all Archaeus had to do was flick his wrist.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by kimothyschma View Post

                  Fred: I've come to the conclusion that I loved Fred because of Amy Acker's incredibly endearing performance. I can no longer care about this character at all, and I'm ready to have Illyria back.
                  Me too.

                  Originally posted by Vampire in Rug View Post
                  I hope its actual Angelus at the end. For starters, Drusilla should be able to tell the difference if he was faking it. Or at least one of the lackeys should be able to sense his soul (if the writers bother the remember that piece of the mythology). If he's not faking it, I'm guessing his soul has gone "dormant" like that time he got his drink spiked, rather than actually gone to the afterlife or into a jar like the other two times he's lost his soul.
                  If he isn't faking, I don't think he lost his soul, it's just that an evil Angel prefers to be called Angelus. If he is faking, Archaeus is pretty weak, not that demon Lord he appears to be - can't he feel the difference???
                  My Tumblr: Dog is My Copilot

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                  • #10
                    I got my copy of Angel & Faith # 21 today.Part I of the final season 10 arc of the series,"A Tale Of Two Familes."

                    I thought this issue was stronger then the last few issues.I liked the bit of confrontation between Angel and Faith.

                    I still think Archaeus is a weak big bad and as others have said,Dru's voice is off.But Dru is tough character to get the voice right.Wish we had gotten that Dru miniseries in season 9 with JL just to see if she could of gotten the voice right for her own character.

                    The Brandt reveal,that he's a vampire was big surprise.

                    I also the Angelus cliffhanger is a fake out or will have twist.

                    Overall liked the issue.

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