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YW/Farewell Buffy

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  • YW/Farewell Buffy

    So the original intended plot for "You're Welcome" was to have Buffy Summers return to see Angel one last time but scheduling conflicts forces Joss to scrap it and use Cordelia instead. I won't speak for everyone but personally I think that this is perhaps one of the most emotional episodes of Angel (Fred's death/transformation into Illyria was sad but she sorta lived on...in a way) but this episode more or less reinforces the fact that Cordelia is really gone 'gone', and is not coming back.

    I thought about what the whole episode would be like if Buffy and Cordelia had swapped places (like in the original script) and Buffy returns to confront Angel about working for W&H and the business with Dana and so on. Even with all of the Cordy lines left in it still could have worked with Buffy. Lindsey could have used the same lie about Cordy for Buffy instead, making Spike think she may be the First Evil perhaps? Cordelia's line: "I know my rights, and I want to see a lawyer" sounds like something witty that Buffy would say, and the ending (believe it or not) would've actually tied into "The Girl in Question" a whole smootly and would have been twice as sad.

    For the ending, Buffy decides "what the hell", they kiss the phone rings and she tells Angel to answer it - using it as a way to flee while he is distracted. She tells him "You're Welcome" as he learns the grim reality of Cordelia's fate, she has died in her coma. Crushed, Angel realizes that he has lost two women in his life (I think this comes in during the Girl in Question) and he decides to pursue Buffy in Italy, not knowing it is a decoy.

    The biggest con I can see about the original idea being used is that Charisma Carpenter/Cordelia is basically killed offscreen and reduced to a silent extra (one thing I have always hated about seasons 4 & 5), and that we never really would have gotten Cordelia closure. Of course if things had gone the way originally intended back in early Season 4, then Cordelia would have killed Jasmine (supposedly) but would have been the big bad herself? So there's no telling how that would have went. What does everyone else think of the idea of "YW" being a Buffy-centric rather than a Cordy episode, like originally intended?
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  • #2
    Would I have preferred the original, Buffy-centric episode?

    Considering the way S4 actually played out, no, not even a little bit.

    I love Buffy as much as the next fan, but this was Angel's show. I was actually really glad that, after S1, they capped the Buffy crossovers and kept it to the supporting characters like Faith, Willow and Andrew. Because, to me, when you bring Buffy to LA and Angel's city, the whole story becomes about her, and you forget that this isn't her show, and she's the supporting character here, not the lead.

    It would have devastated me if all Angel got was a phone call to tell him that Cordelia passed away. She deserves SO much more than that for being the amazing character she was during her four years in LA, and, in fact, it still pisses me off to know that no one ever spoke about her again on the show, and it wasn't until the comics that anyone mentioned her or dealt with her death. Would it really have been so hard to add an extra line here or there about her funeral? Or telling her parents? Or informing Xander and the others? Surely Harmony remembers the year Xander and Cordelia dated?

    Had S4 played out as originally planned before Charisma's pregnancy forced a hasty rewrite, I might feel differently, because no one knows what the final plan was there, if Cordy survived and moved to W&H with the rest of the team.

    But, personally, I love 'You're Welcome', and as much as I hated that they killed off Cordelia, I think it was a fitting end for her.
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    • #3
      I wonder if it would have been different if the series had not been canceled, perhaps there could have been hope for Cordelia after You're Welcome.
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      • #4
        I wonder what you think of Cordelia in the S6 Angel comics.

        It's pretty well known that I don't like the Cordelia character and I think the show was better during her absences. But apparently I'm in the minority on this. It seems a lot of people, including some of the writers, love her so much they will exhaust their ingenuity finding ways to include her in the story. In the comics too, she was mentioned, but there was never much for her to do.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Blix View Post
          I wonder if it would have been different if the series had not been canceled, perhaps there could have been hope for Cordelia after You're Welcome.
          Given that I completely dislike 'After the Fall' and try to block the whole thing from memory, I would have preferred that they left Cordelia as she was after 'You're Welcome'. It was a fitting end for her, she 'got her guy back on track' and that was all she needed to do. I would rather they left her like that, had the show continued.

          And anyway, I doubt Joss would have wanted her back. There's more behind the scenes stuff than we're privy to, but it's not a secret that Joss didn't like the way she handled her pregnancy, which forced the rewrite of S4 in the first place.

          Originally posted by Midwestern Watcher View Post
          It's pretty well known that I don't like the Cordelia character and I think the show was better during her absences. But apparently I'm in the minority on this. It seems a lot of people, including some of the writers, love her so much they will exhaust their ingenuity finding ways to include her in the story. In the comics too, she was mentioned, but there was never much for her to do.
          But surely you agree that she deserved better than a phone call from some clinic nurse in the middle of a completely unrelated episode to inform Angel that, oops, she's dead?

          If that was the case, I'd rather they just left her in the coma and never mentioned her again.
          Para Bellum| Live Journal | Tumblr | Resources

          Si vis pacem, para bellum

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          • #6
            ^
            That I feared would have been the worst fate possible if SMG had been able to do You're Welcome.
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            • #7
              Originally posted by Lyri View Post
              But surely you agree that she deserved better than a phone call from some clinic nurse in the middle of a completely unrelated episode to inform Angel that, oops, she's dead?
              Well, yes.

              In AtS, I felt she was best in S1, where she mostly provided comic relief. In that role, she was OK. Trying to make her into a hero and saint was a mistake, or so I think. At least it never convinced me.

              To be sure, if she's going to die, she should receive a proper sendoff. I actually thought it was pretty good the way they did it.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Blix View Post
                What does everyone else think of the idea of "YW" being a Buffy-centric rather than a Cordy episode, like originally intended?
                Basically the whole problem with Angel was all that stupid s*it about Connor being his son. Otherwise it was relatively good, but Connor really ruined it I think.

                Everything else, including bringing in Harmony and Cordy was good. Evil villians were good, especially the black woman whose only vulnerability was if you said her name. Might be the best villian in the whole Buffyverse.

                But Connor's stupidity and childish behaviour became far too much of a distraction in the series, and in my view, totally ruined it.

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                • #9
                  Cordy´s character was screwed up in season 4 so I am glad
                  that "You´re Welcome" focused on her because it was a fitting end to her arc.

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                  • #10
                    I prefer in YW to be Cordelia, not Buffy. Like Blix said , when Cordy "die" in coma in S4 her character was unfinished. We can`t say good bye to real Cordy. And when she woke up , it was a chance to fit her mistake in the previous season. I still can`t understand why she has to die . And when she woke up in the hospital, every time I remember her words to Giles in S 3 episode " Gingerbread" - ..."Giles, I swear , someday you`ll wake up in coma ..." Does it possible to be a hint ?
                    It really annoys me the fact that Buffy wasn`t appear in episode " The girl in question ". It will be much better episode if Spike and Angel manage to find her.
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                    • #11
                      Cordy was very much screwed in season four and this episode washes away all the character assassination that happened in previous episodes. This episode is such a wonderful farewell and it makes me cry everytime.

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                      • #12
                        This episode made me realize that W&H or Jasmine weren't the big bad of the series, it was Joss.
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