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Was Angel 'Good'?

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  • #16
    Good men don't pursue romantic relationships with teenagers.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by flow View Post
      WillowFromBuffy:

      I am not sure this is a valid comparison. The Nazis had occupied countries. They did kill people in those countries even without sabotage acts. The Senior Partners were not ruling L.A. AtS 5 wasn't a place where a cruel and brutal mass murder had free reign. The SP did not deport people to concentration camps. They did not start a war. On the contrary. They were quite keen on staying quiet and not being dragged into a war.
      1. Wolfram and Hart consider themselves the rulers of LA.
      2. They use vampires to arrange massacres.
      3. They put up hits on children.
      4. They are willing to dissect live babies for science.
      5. They sell bodies to necromancers and werewolves to cannibals to be eaten.
      6. They keep people imprisoned in hell dimensions.
      7. They brainwash rape victims and use them as super powered kamikazee assassins.
      8. They are planning the literal end of the world.
      9. Etc, etc, etc.

      The Senior Partners, Wolfram and Hart, the Black Thorn and all their associates give any real life evil power a run for their money, I think.

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      • #18
        I live in Germany and the age of consent in my country is 16. Every man (or woman) can legally pursue a romance or a sexual affair with a 16-year old teenager no matter his or her own age. This is not just some kind of ancient law that doesn't fit into our times anymore and needs to be revisited. Instead, it is generally accepted in our society that a 16-year-old girl can pursue a romance or a sexual affair with a 26-year-old man and vice versa. There are not only no legal issues but also no moral issues as well. No one would regard anyone as "not good" just because they are in love with a 17-year-old girl.

        flow
        ................................ Banner by buffylover

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        • #19
          Where I live the age of consent is 15 but that's beside the point, I'm not saying that it's illegal - I'm saying that it's not good. Flow imagine that your 16 year old daughter is dating a 70 year man. Would you be OK with that? What would you think about that man? Would you think that man is a good man? Angel's, like, four times as old, he's not 26.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by flow View Post
            WillowFromBuffy:

            I am not sure this is a valid comparison. The Nazis had occupied countries. They did kill people in those countries even without sabotage acts. The Senior Partners were not ruling L.A. AtS 5 wasn't a place where a cruel and brutal mass murder had free reign. The SP did not deport people to concentration camps. They did not start a war. On the contrary. They were quite keen on staying quiet and not being dragged into a war.

            vampmogs
            :

            Funnily enough, I could even find excuses or explanations for two of the three events you mention. Seeing Lindsay facing death and sobbing because Angel didn't even bother to kill him himself was chilling. But it was Lorne, not Angel who pulled the trigger. Lorne could have called this part of the plan off. he didn't because he had seen Lindsay's future and I wonder how much this has triggered the execution order in the first place. Yes, I blame Lorne for this murder more than I blame Angel.
            I have actually missed the pedophile incident until you mentioned it in another thread. We never see this happening on screen which lessens the blow. But mostly I believe this is something that can be undone and maybe Angel has even planned on doing so. Dragon's death can't be undone. It's Angel who kills him and we see it on screen without any sugarcoating.

            As his intentions in doing it are still to do the right thing or what he (mistakenly) believes to be the right thing I would not call him evil either. But sadly he is not good anymore at this point. I wonder if the series ended deliberately on this note and if so why.

            flow
            Problem is Lorne doesn't know the future. Or he kept a whole bunch of things to himself over the run of the show. I blame Lorne as well, but it was ordered by Angel. It's not even really the act itself, more the audacity of Angel being the one to say someone gets no more chances, especially in the same episode he lets Harmony, a soulless vampire that had just betrayed them all, walk.

            You can't undo being labeled a pedophile.

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            • #21
              a thing of evil:
              Flow imagine that your 16 year old daughter is dating a 70 year man. Would you be OK with that? What would you think about that man? Would you think that man is a good man? Angel's, like, four times as old, he's not 26.
              I actually think there are different answers to that depending on whether the said man is 26 years old or 250 years old. The latter option is entirely fictional and implies that the guy in question is also a vampire, immortal or whatever. Regarding the first option I might have to swallow. I might not be overjoyed. But I wouldn't have any say in it and I wouldn't judge this man's goodness simply by the age difference but by how he behaves generally and towards my daughter specifically. This is a hypothetical answer though because I don't have a daughter and I admit I might see things differently if I had.

              flow
              ................................ Banner by buffylover

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