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Positives And Negatives - Season 2

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  • #16

    Positive: I am really enjoying Lindsey. He is so grey, I have no idea how he truly feels about anything or what his true goals are. Kane's performance is so sparse and minimal, but it really works.

    Negative: How do Dru and Darla survive when we've seen other vamps turn to dust from one little spark. I also disliked Darla suggesting Angel now had a third persona when it's all the same man.


    • #17
      Blood Money

      Positive: Really enjoyed Angel in this. He was so sweet, charming and then charmingly psychotic. Angel's a lot of fun in this episode. There are a lot of similarities between him and Lindsey. Special mention to the cuteness that is Wesunn . . . Wunn . . . Gesley . . .

      Negative: I really like seeing Anne and it's one of the strengths of the show that they bring back characters. But how did she get that job? Do the authorities not check out the people who work with kids? She seems like a totally different person, and where has her tat gone?


      • #18
        Wow, it’s really easy to get behind in this thread!

        The Shroud of Rahmon


        Agreed that the relationship between Angel and Kate was the most interesting part of the episode. I loved the end when Angel seems positively mesmerized by drinking human blood again – linking his increasing blood lust to the memory of Darla.


        Angel and company going after a demonic burial shroud that alters the mind is just too convenient for plot dramatics, isn’t it? Next, we’ll have spores that make everyone delusional or a virus that makes everyone cry.

        The Trial


        Love, love, love this episode – another winner in the Darla run of Season Two. More flashbacks of evil Darla betraying Angelus! The scene where Darla tries to get the idiot vamp to sire her – wonderful. The reveal of Darla’s illness – devastating. Lorne. The swimming pool. Jeeves eating a cookie. The three trials. Angel giving his life for Darla – and Darla actually begging Angel not to do it. The bastards who deny Darla her second chance. DRUSILLA. It’s just an overload for me of wonderfully inventive fantasy tinged with tragedy.


        Made me feel that Spike’s trials towards the end of Season Six weren't as exciting in comparison – they should have been more like this – with Buffy involved (in his mind, anyway) and far more psychological in nature.



        Angel waiting for Darla to awake so he can stake her immediately. The awesome fight between Drusilla and Angel. Drusilla and Darla taking out Mr. Pickup Truck. Wicked, evil Darla after killing everyone in the shop: “Service in this place is really unacceptable." The whole chilling scene at the W&H winetasting where Drusilla says to Lilah: “You have beautiful skin.” Lilah: “I moisturize.” Angel locking the door – fantastic. The shock of his crew and their firing. It’s all done so well.


        Too much exposition between Gunn and Wesley to get the audience up to date on what’s happening and who the hell Drusilla is. Crazy Morgog monologue – ugh.



        Angel’s crew all claiming they want to be alone and ending up singing drunkenly at Caritas. Darla kissing Lindsay and then jerking his chain as Lilah watches. Darla’s annoyance at Drusilla’s crazy thoughts. Angel setting the two vamps on fire – really well directed. W&H pitting Lilah and Lindsay against one another. Really like the last scene between Wesley and Angel.


        Wesley and Virginia – boring, no sparks at all compared to Wesley and Fred. Darla and Drusilla getting their vamp band together – it’s all too cliché when Darla rips the demon’s head off and is a pale imitation of Spike’s masterful dusting of the Annoying One.


        • #19
          Made me feel that Spike’s trials towards the end of Season Six weren't as exciting in comparison – they should have been more like this – with Buffy involved (in his mind, anyway) and far more psychological in nature.
          This is such a good point and I hadn't thought of the differences between these and Spike's trials. Perhaps it's different and more psychological because Angel is fighting for someone else, while Spike is seeking something for himself. His mental/psychological strength isn't as important, because the demon doesn't want him to physically survive so he doesn't have to return his soul.

          Whereas Angel is being forced to question his love for Darla, and how much he's prepared to suffer on her behalf, to save her. The demon in this case doesn't care if he lives or dies so much as wanting him to understand what he's doing and to change his mind and decide that Darla isn't worthy of having a champion fight for her.

          Or that's how I'm now going to think of the trials

          - - - Updated - - -

          Happy Anniversary

          Positive: I like that it brings Lorne more into the fold and pairs him with Angel, his opposite in so many ways. The odd couple are then placed in a race against time to stop the end of the world. I really enjoyed that aspect. I also like Lorne drawing parallels between Angel and Gene's situation - the song changes, time moves on, things won't always be like this, which makes a lot of sense when you know Gene and his girlfriend have only been together for a year and now he wants to spend the rest of eternity with her.

          Negative: Gene wants to freeze himself and the woman he loves for all eternity (after a year together!) but even worse is that he wants them frozen just as he comes. There's a yuk factor, even more so when he's portrayed as so ordinary


          • #20
            The Thin Dead Line

            Positive: Angel was my favourite part of this episode. Everyone else was so over the top and in this episode DB's dead pan acting style really works to lessen the melodrama. I also liked how lost he seemed, realising that he's got used to having people around and he's missing the gang. Loved the last shot of him walking away.

            Negative: That 'bugging street slang' just sounds fake and dated Is Anne meant to be the pretty blonde replacement for Kate or a mirror of her, the version of herself she wishes she were? There's also something racist-adjacent about the pretty blonde girl (who's about 20 years old with no qualifications) helping to rescue all these black teens, which undermines what the episode is partly trying to do by looking at institutionalised racism . . . but we've still got to have Jackson to even out the blame. I really don't think a lot in this episode could fly today.


            • #21

              Positive: Loved Angel and Darla's scenes, emotional and powerful. Loving this Angel actually. He really does work best when he's inhabiting the grey areas. Love the 'home office' conceit, Lindsey and Lilah are both great. Even Kate's suicide attempt works, as she's been constantly written as brittle and emotional.

              Negative: Not a lot of negative here. Such a good episode. Maybe Wesley and Virginia's break-up - I've never been interested in them as a couple, so their break-up didn't matter to me.


              • #22

                Positive: Angel and Darla are always a treat. Angel trying to re-connect with Wesley is sweet and funny, and Wes isn't giving him an inch. Nice to see Angel humbled and conciliatory and I enjoyed the 'I got ya' little bit of Cangel Really good episode, would have been great without the inbuilt sexism

                Negative: Lorne's 'You think you're the first guy who ever rolled over, saw what was lying next to him and went 'Guyeah!' just sounded so sexist and horrible. I wish he's said 'person' instead of 'guy'. Once again Cordy is being threatened with demon impregnation.


                • #23

                  Positive: This was a really great episode about the complexity of Cordy. She's passed over as boss,(even thought she was there first and Wes is injured) She doesn't see herself as a 'detective', more an office manager, but she also reliving her glory days with Harmony (they are wonderful together) and talking about how she's changed, how happy she is and talks about the 'work I'm doing . . . that we're doing', undervaluing herself. She seems, when compared to Harmony, to have grown so much, yet at the end of the ep she becomes the old Cordy when faced with someone giving her presents. Just love all these aspects of Cordy.

                  Negative: Didn't like the faux-lesbian misunderstanding and Cordy's horror played for laughs.

                  - - - Updated - - -

                  Dead End

                  Positive: The scenes between Lindsey and Angel are great. Love Angel's jealousy and Lindsey's childlike tantrum later. There is great chemistry between these two. They bring out the worst in each other and it's fun to watch.

                  Negative: Felt like poor Cordy's having women's problems, having feelings and the men in the office just don't know how to handle them. The visions as PMS. They can't even talk to her like she's part of the team, an equal, they behave like she's being over emotional and is somehow separate from them. They actually appear really pathetic. It should be sweet when Angel turns up with the food, but really, it's like buying her clothes last episode, it's separating her, making her different. Cordy is the most important resource they have, but they don't treat her like that, and she doesn't know how important she is.


                  • #24
                    Positive: Lorne.
                    Negative: The case with the pregnant woman is not really interesting.

                    Are You Now Or Have You Ever Been
                    Positive: Everything.
                    Negative: Kind of a nitpick, but no one in the hotel ever wonders what happen to Angel's body after they hung him.

                    First Impressions
                    Positive: The Angel and Darla dream scenes.
                    Negative: Everything else.

                    Positive: First appearance of Gunn's hubcap ax.
                    Negative: This episode pretty much feel's like filler. It does nothing to advance the season's story line. Bethany's Dad coming to a sudden stop four feet from the ground is pretty goofy.
                    My deviantart:


                    • #25

                      Positive: Angel's pleasure at being on the set was so sweet, foreshadowing what is to come. Lorne is always a pleasure and it's fun to get some backstory for him. Love the way he describes Angel's perfect world.

                      Negative: Not sure how we're meant to feel about Angel stepping up to the commercial director, who was an absolute *******, but it wasn't his place. Then Angel, Gunn and Wes all take a moment to enjoy the visualisation of Cordy in a bikini - making their friend nothing more than an object. All this plays into the problems Cordy's had over the last few episodes, and here she's made to feel less because she can't get the job she wants without showing off her body and isn't doing an important job like the 'boys' playing detectives, and she's already said she feels like the office manager, and once again she asks 'why does everyone always ask me if I'm okay?' Cordy is so strong, and she's struggling in this world.

                      I just don't know if the writers mean to highlight Cordy's problems, or I'm just seeing stuff that isn't there. Or time has changed the meaning of what's on screen. So really this negative could also be considered a positive I think it must be meant because in an episode about belonging, and Cordy's felt like she hasn't belonged for a while now, she ends up in another dimension, in a world that embraces her for who she is and she finally gets to belong (I know it doesn't end well, but unfortunately that's Cordy's lot in life - it never ends well)

                      I've never watched AtS through Cordy's eyes before, making her the central character, and it really opens the show up and makes me think about it in ways I never have before. So I guess my only real negative is that I really don't care about Wesley's daddy issues or that Gunn is growing apart from his crew.


                      • #26
                        Over The Rainbow

                        Positive:Angel being so gleeful about being in the sun is just great and Lorne hating being back in his home dimension is so much fun, 'your standard film noir'.

                        Negative: Is her name 'Frankie'? The friend of Lornes who suddenly appears and can find a portal, which seems very fortunate, like she's the therapists therapist. I don't think we see her again do we?


                        • #27
                          Through The Looking Glass

                          Positive: Angel's pleasure at seeing his reflection is great, but then the twist is that his demon face is different in this world, and he's not able to control himself. That all works really well. Special mention for Lorne and his family, they were gold.

                          Negative: Cordy should kick these moogs to the curb pronto. Gunn's line 'She's the messiah' make me want to smash his face in She's got the visions from TPB, what have you got? A pick-up truck you conned a demon for? And as Cordy says herself 'why do demons in every dimension want to impregnate me' - it's funny, but it's also annoying that the only thing the writers can think to do to put the main female character in jeopardy is the threat of impregnation - and then they have her questioning herself 'Do I put out some sort of comshuck vibe?'


                          • #28
                            There's No Place Like Plrtz Glrb

                            Positive: When Lorne's decapitated head starts talking, so funny. I like that Cordy calls the visions an honour, and rescues herself at last. Willow's appearance at the end bought a lump to my throat.

                            Negative: I'm not a fan of Groo, he never questions the monks, he doesn't seem capable of running anything, never mind a country. Gunn's final speech makes me cringe.


                            • #29
                              Dear Boy
                              Positive: Pretty great episode. I especially love the plot twist that Darla was brought back as a human.
                              You have Angel who might become human again someday cause of the Shanshu Prophecy, and here's Darla who has what Angel wants, and she doesn't appreciate the fact that she has a second chance.

                              Negative: Lindsey and Darla's plan to frame Angel for murder feels pretty pointless.
                              Also the case with the husband thinking that his wife is getting abducted by aliens is really stupid.
                              My deviantart:


                              • #30
                                Well I've just started rewatching S2 so I'm back to add to the single effort I made when Pricey first went through this one.


                                Positive - I like seeing Wes developing with the gained confidence that truly being wanted/accepted finally has given him. He's gained a touch of competence with it, but is still trying to push it that little bit more, so he still makes a bit of a fool of himself in the bar too. His knowledge of the demon community in LA, his awareness of Merle and Caritas, fits to the demon hunter image he was trying to build before. Knowing the underworld and about pivotal places and people that could aid them. It fits the detective aspect too, greatly research based but about wanting to be of practical help as well. Seeing that side of him emerging naturally when he is feeling at ease is great.

                                Negative - I enjoy this episode and although I'd never say it was a favourite I genuinely find it really hard to pick a negative. Any that I think of I then reason them away for myself. I'll go with the fact that the show uses so much stereotyping with Gunn's character that while seeing Cordelia getting in a fluster when she does that when Gunn arrives is funny, it's inclusion just makes me feel that the writers don't see how much they do this themselves constantly. I'd like to think that it is actually there because they realised on reflection of S1 and wrote it in deliberately 'at' themselves, but the ongoing reoccurrence of this makes me wonder still.

                                Are You Now Or Have You Ever Been is the single ep I did last time (and is my personal favourite) so I won't be back to this for possible over a week when I get on to episode 3.

                                Originally posted by Priceless View Post
                                Why didn't the pregnant woman tell Angel that the demon was her friend before he killed him? She just stood there, silent, she should have opened her mouth. Her stupidity was used to further the story, but it was too unbelievable.
                                I just assumed that she thought Angel was an enemy. So from her point of view she was watching her protector protecting her. Angel tells her he is not a threat himself when he first arrives but the Prio demon then attacks him so she might believe that her bodyguard knows better and is doing his job. So it would have been strange if she was yelling to Angel to not hurt the demon when she thinks it is fighting to keep her safe against him I think.

                                I agree with previous negative comments that the pregnant woman storyline lacks.