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2020 U.S. Presidential Election Thread

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  • JM has promised a personal message on Twitter to everyone who votes (no matter whom you vote for):

    https://twitter.com/JamesMarstersOf/...736448/photo/1

    flow
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    • Stoney
      Stoney commented
      Editing a comment
      Cripes he might regret that, maybe he's got a few days free.

  • Okay...Trump's just been endorsed by the Taliban. Is that a good thing or a bad thing? Are they the good guys or the bad guys now?
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    • flow
      flow commented
      Editing a comment
      Well, lemme think ... they are misogynists, racists, anti-democrats and generally hate everyone and everything that isn't them. Oh, and they think they are god-send. It makes total sense for them to endorse Trump.

    • TriBel
      TriBel commented
      Editing a comment
      flow Greta Thunberg's endorsed Biden. Can I cheer that on? Asking for a friend.

  • Originally posted by TriBel View Post
    Okay...Trump's just been endorsed by the Taliban. Is that a good thing or a bad thing? Are they the good guys or the bad guys now?
    To his supporters... they'll be the good guys now. Based on my observations the way it tends to work is that they'll literally just cave and fold and go along with whatever Trump tells them even if it literally contradicts everything they personally believed beforehand.

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    • Originally posted by vampmogs View Post

      To his supporters... they'll be the good guys now. Based on my observations the way it tends to work is that they'll literally just cave and fold and go along with whatever Trump tells them even if it literally contradicts everything they personally believed beforehand.
      See...I found this quote once - a paraphrase from Freud to the effect of "to be able to live with paradox is a sign of maturity". It's always stood me in good stead - until now. Now...I'm kinda getting a bit brassed off with left being right, up being down and black being white. We really need out of this rabbit hole.
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      • Originally posted by TriBel View Post

        See...I found this quote once - a paraphrase from Freud to the effect of "to be able to live with paradox is a sign of maturity". It's always stood me in good stead - until now. Now...I'm kinda getting a bit brassed off with left being right, up being down and black being white. We really need out of this rabbit hole.
        Oh totally agree.

        The problem is you seem to have a considerable amount of the population who are now outright rejecting science, evidence, fact and education as merely "fake news" or "opinion" and supporting an administration that talks about "alternative facts." People with educations or experience to actually do the job, like President, are now seen as "elite." It's scary.

        People can be complex, nuanced and surprising. Not everyone fits into stereotypes. But it's maddening when it comes to Trump supporters because their backflips don't have anything to do with nuance. It's literally a case of them not thinking for themselves and twisting themselves like a pretzel to agree with whatever Trump says or does. I mean, how many times has it been reported that Trump has said something stupid/bad/racist/the usual and his supporters jump up and down crying "fake news!" and "he'd never say that!" only for it to be revealed he did and suddenly their position changes from "He'd never say that, the media is trying to make him look bad!" to "So what if he did say that?" It was "bad" until they realise he really did say that... and then it's suddenly no big deal that he did.

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        • It's an exceptional bit of trolling by the Taliban but not sure they really 'read the room' very well. The US just passed it's 19th anniversary of fighting in Afghanistan. For almost that whole time we've had no coherent strategy or tactical commitment to eliminating an enemy. This is blame shared equally by the Bush and Obama administrations. Being in Afghanistan fighting as an end unto itself is the only apparent reason for being there, and the best argument for how quickly the "war on terror" turned into the "war on drugs".

          My personal opinion is that the US military should never be deployed overseas unless it's being sent to complete a defined objective and that it be used in absolute and overwhelming fashion to achieve that objective. If what I call the "war party" in American politics (a bipartisan cabal that has included or at least dominated politicians from Bush to Lieberman to Biden to McCain and despises Donald Trump) were to give up on nation-building (an amorphous and futile objective to which our military is ill-suited) and instead get on with "go door to door summarily wiping out the Taliban or their enablers until everyone in Afghanistan denies any affiliation like Peter denied Christ, and then go home", I'd be all for it.

          But they aren't, so to hell with them. Getting out of endless foreign wars was something Trump ran on, and has been pretty mediocre at accomplishing (although not a complete failure; he managed to keep us out of starting a new one in Syria despite lots of war party pressure to do so), but win or lose I hope he sticks to (and pushes past the resistance in the Pentagon and IC against) his recent tweet to have our forces out of Afghanistan by Christmas.

          It's been a long decade since 2009 when it seemed like we might be leaving Iraq (or mostly) with some sense that we had goals to accomplish there and that the Iraqi people were counting on us. A decade that saw each more foolish galaxy brain scheme for asymmetrical and proxy campaigns in the Middle East fail more spectacularly than the last and actually destabilize countries and worse conditions there (Libya, Egypt, Syria, Yemen, Saudi Arabia). We've proven we suck at this. We've wasted a generation on this foolhardy Bush doctrine in "nation building". We never would have tried to conduct the Marshall Plan in 1944.

          All of which is to say, bravo for them, the Taliban prefers Trump because they want us out of Afghanistan. But they underestimate how many Americans also want us out of Afghanistan because we're tired of our soldiers dying because they've never really been unleashed to annihilate the Taliban in the first place and instead get killed piecemeal trying to democratize a society that clearly isn't all that interested.

          I wouldn't put "the Taliban endorses Trump" as more persuasive than the extreme likelihood that Trump will win America's enlisted vote 3:2 or 3:1, either.
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          • TriBel
            TriBel commented
            Editing a comment
            To be fair, I think the Republicans have rejected the endorsement.

        • All said regarding writers, producers, actors, directors, viewers, readers, etc. are what I remember, my opinions, etc.

          What’s said in this post/comment is what I remember, my opinions, etc.





          * If the US Census is not being accurately done, the Biden Administration to redo the US Census and if any US Supreme Court Justice rules against that, that Justice should be immediately Impeached.


          * I'm not sure why the Democrats aren't Impeaching a large portion of the Trump Administration.


          * US Representative Ro Khanna has recently showed baffling weakness regarding Republican obstruction. His US Supreme Court term limits thing is incredibly stupid and doesn't even apply to the current Justices and wouldn't apply to Amy Comey Barrett.

          And his wanting to accept the Trump Administration's stimulus offer is incredibly weak and pathetic.

          I used to consider he'd be the best choice for California Governor Gavin Newsom to make a US Senator. Now, it seems both US Representatives Karen Bass and US Representative Barbara Lee would be better choices.

          The Democrats seemingly are rather openly signaling that they'll 'pack the Court' if Amy Comey Barrett is confirmed. So, why is a progressive somehow being so pathetic instead of wanting to 'pack the Court'. And it's not a good look when US Speaker of the House of Representatives Nancy Pelosi is a universe more strong against the Trump Administration than you are. I'm not even aware of many of the 'Problem Solvers Caucus'-type people who want to simply do a Trump stimulus.


          * EDIT #1: I'm currently watching the Speaker Pelosi and Wolf Blizter interview. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqPltMpWIwo

          Andrew Yang just lost his chances to become US President and maybe any real future in politics. You don't show yourself a strong and effective Democrat by agreeing with the Trump Administration--especially when they are in a incredibly weak position and POTUS Trump is almost certain to lose re-election. The Republican Senators are very vulnerable as well and US Senator Mitch McConnell and US Federal Judge Amy Comey Barrett are 2 of the most unpopular people in the United States.

          EDIT #2: Wolf Blizter simply repeats his talking point of "$1.8T and the American people need that money and I'm quoting 2 people who represent a tiny portion of the Democratic Party" and he's speaking rather condescendingly to the person who is third in the Line of Succession. Wolf seems to consider during this interview to be more important and valuable to the United States than someone who was the most powerful United States Speaker of the House of Representatives ever and who seemingly is recently growing a backbone because of threat of AOC.

          Wolf seems to not know or not acknowledge that Speaker Pelosi is a member of the DEMOCRATIC Party. And that POTUS Trump is unpopular and the US Senate Republicans are even more unpopular than POTUS Trump. Wolf doesn't seem to want Speaker Pelosi to negotiate.

          Speaker Pelosi did some push-back against the Problem Solvers Caucus. It's possible Speaker Pelosi sees the 'writing on the wall' and that the Democratic Party and the US public are becoming more Progressive. Ridding of the filibuster, packing the Federal courts, and making both Puerto Rico and Washington D.C. States will finally better Balance the US Federal Government to be more representative of the actual US population.
          Last edited by MikeB; 14-10-20, 06:01 AM.

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          • Originally posted by MikeB View Post
            * If the US Census is not being accurately done, the Biden Administration to redo the US Census and if any US Supreme Court Justice rules against that, that Justice should be immediately Impeached.
            There is nothing improper going on with the census. Or are you now of the opinion that Stephen Breyer and Elena Kagan are MAGA stooges?

            I'm not sure why the Democrats aren't Impeaching a large portion of the Trump Administration.
            Because what most improves their chance to win elections and what most makes you personally satisfied are almost diametrically opposite. They aren't impeaching it because normies that they need votes from know it would be baseless, pretextual, and vindictive to do so without legitimate grounds, and there aren't any.

            And his wanting to accept the Trump Administration's stimulus offer is incredibly weak and pathetic.
            Have you ever heard the expression "saying the quiet part aloud"? That's this. This was that. You aren't supposed to just flat out say you don't want an agreement on more covid relief so that you can keep campaigning on the lack of more covid relief, but that's basically what you just admitted.

            The Democrats seemingly are rather openly signaling that they'll 'pack the Court' if Amy Comey Barrett is confirmed. So, why is a progressive somehow being so pathetic instead of wanting to 'pack the Court'. And it's not a good look when US Speaker of the House of Representatives Nancy Pelosi is a universe more strong against the Trump Administration than you are. I'm not even aware of many of the 'Problem Solvers Caucus'-type people who want to simply do a Trump stimulus.
            In leadership and on the ticket, no, they aren't openly signaling it and both Biden/Harris and any competitive Senate candidate are still generally refusing to answer or even discuss it. Why? Because, again, the normies they need votes from know it's dirty pool that lances the legitimacy of the courts.

            Speaker Pelosi did some push-back against the Problem Solvers Caucus. It's possible Speaker Pelosi sees the 'writing on the wall' and that the Democratic Party and the US public are becoming more Progressive. Ridding of the filibuster, packing the Federal courts, and making both Puerto Rico and Washington D.C. States will finally better Balance the US Federal Government to be more representative of the actual US population.
            You have never answered or even acknowledged this question - if the policies in that paragraph are the progressive future and they are wildly popular ideas that the majority of Americans support... why do Democrats refuse to discuss them, let alone openly campaign on them? What do they know that you don't, Mike?
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            • All said regarding writers, producers, actors, directors, viewers, readers, etc. are what I remember, my opinions, etc.

              What’s said in this post/comment is what I remember, my opinions, etc.





              * The California Republican Party is continuing to do election tampering and such. I don't know why the members responsible for the fake ballot boxes aren't immediately arrested and sued and thrown in federal prison.



              https://www.speaker.gov/newsroom/101320-1

              It seems US Speaker Pelosi might be open to re-doing the Census if there isn't an accurate count. It's against the US Constitution and one of the most important things about the founding of the United States to not do an accurate US Census.

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              • Originally posted by MikeB View Post
                It seems US Speaker Pelosi might be open to re-doing the Census if there isn't an accurate count. It's against the US Constitution and one of the most important things about the founding of the United States to not do an accurate US Census.
                The Supreme Court on a vote of 7-1 just said your assertion is incorrect.
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                • Originally posted by vampmogs View Post

                  To his supporters... they'll be the good guys now. Based on my observations the way it tends to work is that they'll literally just cave and fold and go along with whatever Trump tells them even if it literally contradicts everything they personally believed beforehand.
                  Believe it or not, I’m seeing posts like that on Osama bin Laden now that he’s attached to a weird conspiracy theory in which Obama, Biden and Clinton murdered Navy Seals and replaced OBL with a body double to pretend he was dead and cover up their nefarious crimes. At this point, bin Laden will be living in pizza parlor basements with children, talking to Elvis and Julian Assange about how to overthrow the neoliberal order and its pedophile empire that installed space aliens in Benghazi under the direct order of George Soros.

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                  • flow
                    flow commented
                    Editing a comment
                    I'm sure Obama drops by in that basement from time to time to share a mug of children's blood with his mate Osama.

                • FWIW Robert O'Neill is a pretty popular figure among the American right wing, and he personally settled bin Laden's tab.
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                  • flow
                    flow commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Well, that's what he says. But if he was the one to replace the original Osama with the body double it's pretty obvious he has to tell lies to cover his ass ... although I don't really get why Obama wants to overthrow the neoliberal order

                  • American Aurora
                    American Aurora commented
                    Editing a comment
                    KoC, I wasn’t referring to conservatives - just the conspiracy-minded people who seem to believe in stuff one step away from BatBoy as a Trump advisor.

                    I’ve seen equally loopy stuff on the left - but Q people are more visible these days.

                • All said regarding writers, producers, actors, directors, viewers, readers, etc. are what I remember, my opinions, etc.

                  What’s said in this post/comment is what I remember, my opinions, etc.





                  * POTUS Trump tweeted in support of the California Republican Party's fake ballots box thing. He should be thrown in federal prison and so should all the California Republican Party members and people who are doing the fake ballot box thing. And they all should be sued.


                  * Outside of the Trump Administration being fascist and trying to be fascist and the Republicans who support or don't care about that fascism, things are looking okay for the Democrats in the United States.

                  - The Post Office will supposedly reverse all the changes it made that hampered mail and will prioritize election mail. It seems DeJoy probably feared being sued and prosecuted.

                  - The US Senate is almost certain to become Democratic-controlled.

                  - Joseph Biden will be the next President of the United States of America. The US Supreme Court would lose all legitimacy by the majority of the United States if it tries to give the election to POTUS Trump.


                  * If there were actual justice in the United States, much of the Trump Administration would be sued and put in State or Federal prison. Some of the US Senators and US Representatives as well. And various people in State and local governments.


                  * POTUS Trump is responsible for 100s of Ks of American deaths and millions of Americans having what will likely be permanent bodily damage. He might go down in history as the worst and most incompetent US President.

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                  • flow
                    flow commented
                    Editing a comment
                    It's ain't over till the fat lady sings ...

                • All said regarding writers, producers, actors, directors, viewers, readers, etc. are what I remember, my opinions, etc.

                  What’s said in this post/comment is what I remember, my opinions, etc.




                  * Apparently, the Biden Town Hall got better ratings than the Trump Town Hall.


                  * US Senator Diane Feinstein should not be in Democratic Leadership. She was very pathetic during the Brett Kavanaugh hearings and somehow she's even more pathetic during the Amy Comey Barrett hearings.


                  * I didn't watch either Town Hall and generally don't watch Town Halls.

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                  • Originally posted by KingofCretins View Post
                    FWIW Robert O'Neill is a pretty popular figure among the American right wing, and he personally settled bin Laden's tab.
                    I saw Robert O'Neill making a joke on Twitter about him killing Osama bin Johnson instead of Osama bin Laden. I have no idea if it is a cultural thing or a language thing but I don't get the joke. Why is it funny? Who is Osama bin Johnson?

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