Announcement

Collapse
1 of 2 < >

No HTML

HTML is turned off for security reasons.

Please do not use html in your posts or messages. If you are copy and pasting something from another website and you are having problems with it showing, then it may have html in it. This could be in the form of a website link or a viewable image or an emoji or a special chacter. I am not sure this is the reason we have errors posting.

Some html code can be simply swapped with our Bulletin Board code by changing the greater than/ less than signs with bracket signs. Other BB code needs to done using the buttons in the advanced post editor.
2 of 2 < >

Home Page

The home page address has changed to: http://buffyforums.net/forums/
Please update your bookmark. Otherwise, the home page does not show you are logged in and/or will not let you type into the log in box in the top right. The link at Buffyforums.net to the forums has not yet been updated. So you will experience the error when you enter the forum through that link.
See more
See less

What`s going on in the U.S.?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • What`s going on in the U.S.?

    I listen to the news and know, what they tell us about what`s going on with the government shutdown and all.

    I don`t want to discuss politics and I don`t want this to be an anti-Trump thread. I just would like to know, how those of you, who live in the U.S. feel right now.
    Are you frightened? Upset? Angry? Or is this just business as usual? Do you think, everything will get back on track shortly? Or will things spiral down fast? What is going to be next? Impeachment? Military taking over? People marching towards the White House? Trump being put on trial? Everyone waiting calmly for the 2020 upcoming elections?

    Sitting here and watching tv it is sometimes difficult for me to grasp, what`s going on. Or is this just an example for media hysteria and everything is running smoothly over there, where you live?

    flow
    ................................ Banner by buffylover

  • #2
    I know you said that you didn't want a Trump-bashing thread but well....I see no other way to answer the question. I'm not concerned about this particular shut-down but I'm pretty scared about the next two years with Trump. Government shutdowns are "business as usual" in today's political climate. This is the third time that it's shut down in a year. The federal departments have become skilled at moving money around to make sure operations continue for awhile. I'm sure I'd feel differently if I or anyone in my family was a federal employee but I don't really have much of a direct and daily relationship with the federal government. Most critical services for daily living are provided by state and municipal governments which remain completely open. Moreover, this is a partial shutdown of the federal government so technically, only a quarter of the federal government is unfunded and forced to close. Critical departments like the Department of Defense are still open. Social security checks are likely still going out. Everything is calm for now as the people are distracted by the holidays.

    Moreover, Trump has significant incentives to resolve this one quickly. The Democrats will take the House of Representatives in a few weeks so he likely won't see such a cooperative House any time soon. Even some conservative outlets don't buy his pivot to blame Democrats for the shut-down only weeks after he gleefully said that he was happy to own a shutdown for the border wall. I see the political calculation to fight over the border wall to please Trump's conservative base including with a showy government shutdown. I don't see the political calculation to let this linger through the Democrats' take over of the House when Trump will be faced with a indubitably less desirable outcome.

    However, I'm really scared of the next two years. The first two years of the Trump presidency have been nerve-wracking and marked by political dysfunction and rancor during peace time, while the economy has been humming along, while Republicans occupied both houses of Congress, before Mueller started the Russia probe and then while Mueller has been investigating but hasn't come out with his final conclusions. Trump can't even function as a normal president with every wind at his back. I don't know how Trump will function with Democrats occupying the House over the next two years if he can't even keep the government open with his own party occupying both houses of Congress. I think we're in for longer, deeper, more complete shut-downs in the next two years and the more frequent shutdowns can actually do some damage to government function and an economy which is already starting to enter a bear market (especially the trade fears from Trump's OTHER stupid policies).
    Last edited by Dipstick; 22-12-18, 10:45 PM.

    Comment


    • #3
      What Dipstick said. The shut down is not that a huge deal...yet. These things usually only last for a few days, and aren't much more than political theatre.

      Most people I know are waiting — not always calmly — for 2020. The midterm elections were some comfort to many who felt powerless. After the new house is sworn in, Nancy Pelosi will be second in line for the presidency, after Mike Pence. If Trump should leave office for any reason, the rules of succession left the Dems with very little to hope for prior to this election, except a more savvy political player in the office of POTUS. (The Dems will not get the presidency before 2020, barring some unexpected catastrophe, however.) The thing is that Trump is unpredictable. I can see him doing something so extreme in his paranoia that it forces the citizenry (or the military, or congress, or the states) to take action before the next election.

      I'm more concerned about Ruth Bader Ginsberg's health than the shutdown, frankly. Another Trump appointment to the Supremes would have longer lasting consequences than anything I can think of.
      Weird love is better than no love — Buffy Summers

      Comment


      • #4
        Oh yeah - pray for RBG!

        Trump terrifies me. I say this even having friends who are Trump supporters. Part of the problem is the constant painting other Americans as the enemy. We were all kinda operating on prejudices before we met - now I know how much we have in common. I worry about how or even if the general population will be able to come back together after this disaster. In order for Trump to remain successful he has to gin up the hate - and that will remain long after he leaves office.

        The shutdown doesn't affect me personally but it extends beyond DC. Last I read almost 800,000 people will either get an unpaid vacation or will have to work with no pay over the holiday season. Once the pissing contest is over they will get back pay but that doesn't help much with holiday issues. The people who have to stay home are considered non essential - so those who stay will be doing more than one job. It is a major cluster duck that didn't need to happen. The annoying thing is this insistence on a border wall as if this was just after the fall of the Roman Empire. I live near the border. Building a wall will be ridiculously expensive - there is no infrastructure to support workers in 100+ degree heat. Technology makes a lot of things easier - a wall is just something more to tunnel under.

        I really wish we had a parliamentary democracy where cooperation of some sort was necessary to even have a govt. The 2018 elections were a huge no confidence vote. I also wish we had a viable third party.
        Can we agree that the writers made everyone do and say everything with a thought to getting good ratings and being renewed. This includes everything we love as well as everything we hate.

        Comment


        • #5
          Government "shutdowns" in the US are, at best, a misnomer. Contrary to however this may reported, it has no effect whatsoever on
          A) social security
          B) medicare/medicaid
          C) VA benefits

          None of these programs require appropriation. A shutdown, as it were, effects only about 15-20% of federal spending. Some employees are furloughed but almost all of those effected continue working but with deferred pay. 100% of hours work receive full pay for the time they should have been compensated during the shutdown.

          So at most, a "shutdown" disrupts the cash flow but not the earnings of about 400k fed employees/contractors. And other than for the news covering it breathlessly, the fact of the matter is that unless you are personally acquainted with one of them, there is virtually no chance ordinary people would even notice it was going on.

          So it is about the most trivial of all reasons to panic. We have done this something like 40 times since 1975 or so, under Presidents and Congressional majorities of every combination.

          By the way, the dates at which these CR spending agreements expire are not arbitrary. They are always put right before Christmas, or Memorial Day, or Independence Day, or Labor Day as a cheap and exploitative emotional hook to force any and every policy concession to avoid the general non-event of a "shutdown". If you knew nothing else about them, knowing that should make you at least skeptical of people staking their argument's merits to the idea that a shutdown must be avoided at all cost.
          sigpic
          Banner by LRae12

          Comment


          • #6
            All caught up

            All said regarding writers, producers, actors, directors, viewers, readers, etc. are what I remember, my opinions, etc.





            * Government shutdowns are bad for the economy, bad for the bond market, and bad for peoples’ faith in the Government.


            * The United States still is the most powerful country in the world and seemingly will remain so for the foreseeable future. It’s more powerful than China, and now even more powerful than Europe combined.


            * Japan is militarizing and tensions with North Korea have cooled.


            * There seems little sign that Russia will ally with the US against China if need be, so US President Donald Trump’s appeasement of Russia so far has very little benefit to the US. If anything, Russia and Saudi Arabia feel more empowered than they’ve been in years.


            * The Democrats now controlling the US House of Representatives and US Representative-elect Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez being the most popular Congressperson means no dismantling of Social Security and no dismantling of Medicare to pay for tax cuts for the rich.

            With the US Stock Market down, those tax cuts didn’t even benefit the rich except for those savvy enough to know when to ‘get out’ and then get ‘back in’.


            * Either President Trump will be removed from office before the US 2020 A.D. elections or he’ll be otherwise further weakened politically before then. Mike Pence would be easier to beat because of the lack of enthusiasm for Mike Pence.


            * The burden is on the Democrats—particularly the ‘corporate’ or ‘conservative’ Democrats. Around 70% of Americans support ‘Medicare for All’ and even around a majority of Republicans support ‘Medicare for All’. There seems resistance from ‘corporate’ Democrats in the US House to support a ‘Medicare for All’ bill.

            Free college tuition isn’t actually that expensive compared to other Government programs. Especially if it includes such things as only applying to ‘decent and better’ colleges—aka no for-profit colleges, no ’13th grade’ colleges, etc.—only applying once the student gets a degree/graduates, etc. And we need more colleges.


            * And Democrats need to stop with the ‘identity politics’ and choose people who can win. Choosing black people in winnable Georgia and Florida races wasn’t a good idea.

            People need to remember that Barack Obama was liked by White people and won the Iowa caucuses. People need to remember that he lost to US Senator John McCain largely because of Tina Fey’s impersonation of Governor Sarah Palin (and McCain’s choosing of Sarah Palin).

            And they should stop with the ‘Republican-lite’ nonsense. The MODERATE position now is gay rights, Medicare for All, free college tuition, etc.

            US Senator Bernie Sanders would have beaten Donald Trump. US Senator Bernie Sanders will beat Donald Trump and will beat Mike Pence.


            * I’m glad US Democratic House Leader Nancy Pelosi will become the next Speaker of the United States House of Representatives. I’m not glad that power has been given to ‘conservative’ House Democrats. But policy is what matters. And money still wins elections because most people are uniformed and misinformed. Fundraising is still very important.

            So, we’ll see. I hope ‘Medicare for All’ and ‘free college tuition’ bills will be passed by the US House of Reps.

            Comment


            • #7
              I agree with everything except * And Democrats need to stop with the ‘identity politics’ and choose people who can win. Choosing black people in winnable Georgia and Florida races wasn’t a good idea.

              Are you seriously saying that voters in the Dem primaries should avoid POC in states where color might matter? You just pointed out that Obama won in lily white Iowa. The Georgia and Florida races were lost in states where there was definite voter suppression - ad they were still nail biters.

              Yes - on medicare for all and free college. We need Pelosi, and we need the Dems to grow a backbone. Maybe deciding that Republicans can't stand her is a good thing is the first step.
              Can we agree that the writers made everyone do and say everything with a thought to getting good ratings and being renewed. This includes everything we love as well as everything we hate.

              Comment


              • #8
                Honestly there are a few of those wish list items that are farther away in another direction than reorganization, dissolution, or civil war. National 100% taxpayer subsidized liberal arts degrees in an economy that needed to wake up and smell vocational training and professional trades 20 years ago probably a big example. How is anybody helped by further devaluing a bachelor's degree at full taxpayer expense?

                BTW, as a Floridian, I can assure you Gillum lost because he is an avowed socialist and a hard line gun control advocate, not because he is black; the state went for Obama twice. Similar results with Abrams in GA. This election proved, once again, that running on a platform featuring significant civilian disarmament is a near guaranteed loser in statewide races in competitive states. See also Beto, McCaskill.
                sigpic
                Banner by LRae12

                Comment


                • #9
                  I am disgusted anyone would suggest excluding POC from political races on the basis that they’re not white and therefore guaranteed to lose. I mean, firstly, what a sad, sad indictment of America if it’s so racist that, that is true. Secondly, how dare POC be excluded from anything based on the colour of their skin. And last of all, Democrats need to be better than that. The Republicans have chosen power over country by electing that orange, disgusting POS and have sacrificed all morals and decency in the process, and now people think Democrats should go full-blown racist to try and snatch power back!? No. As much as I get the desire to cave in and do whatever’s “nescessary” to win, I think there’s some lines that should not be crossed. Sometimes principles matter more. Stand up for what you believe in. Don’t sacrifice your morals and dignity just to win like the Republicans have. We all know the majority of them think Trump’s a loathsome moron but, guess what, they won’t stand up to him and they continue to let him behave that way, so they’re loathsome morons now too.

                  Besides, the Democrats are doing well when they embrace really strong liberal candidates. They seem to be doing worse when they back moderate and less progressive candidates. That was the issue with Clinton. If they have any sense I think they should back someone as polar opposite to Trump as possible.
                  - "The earth is doomed" -

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by vampmogs View Post
                    Besides, the Democrats are doing well when they embrace really strong liberal candidates. They seem to be doing worse when they back moderate and less progressive candidates. That was the issue with Clinton. If they have any sense I think they should back someone as polar opposite to Trump as possible.
                    Democrats have done well on state level or district level elections when they tailor the candidate to the district. That means they can run socialist candidates in districts where those ideas are already popular- like Ocasio Cortez in the Bronx. However, centrist Democrats were the only ones able to capture red or red-purple districts/states like Conor Lamb in Pennsylvania or Doug Jones in Alabama (helped by how Roy Moore was a perv). An avowed socialist couldn't win there. As a fellow Floridian, I agree with King that this blocked Gillum from winning Florida instead of the color of his skin. However, I agree with bespangled that it was a nail-biter and further, the passage of Amendment 4 on the same ballot will also tilt Florida more to Democrats when felons have their voting rights restored.

                    It hasn't been tested whether a socialist candidate like Bernie Sanders could win the Presidency. I'm agnostic on whether Bernie could have beaten Trump. It was a really weird race. Generally I believe that if Bernie couldn't beat Hillary within the left ranks of the country (the Democratic primaries and caucuses), I don't believe his socialist policies would have take him over the top when throwing Republicans and non-party affiliated into the mix. However, both Hillary and Trump were very much famous known quantities to the American public who've had decades to build up negative views of them. That sunk Hillary more than Trump and Bernie Sanders wouldn't have come in with such a deficit. However, that's just it. If Bernie could've have beaten Trump, it wouldn't be because his policies were more popular than Hillary's policies. It'd be because he would be more personally popular and likable.

                    Socialism has become more popular. I think a medicare-for-all platform is an outright winner right now with the American mainstream. LOL, but Trump promised "great healthcare for everybody" in his proposed repeal of Obamacare and a lot of his voters actually voted for THAT because they were conned. However, there's a limit. A Democrat who has a platform of medicare-for-all, federally funded tuition, AND a federal program guaranteeing a job and/or basic income all at the same time* will lose. Maybe even with me, a Democrat who's voted for a Democrat in every presidential election, except for the fact that I think the first priority is to throw Trump out of office.

                    *Absent some revolution in AI technology that displaces a critical mass of workers. This will happen at some point and will likely require some kind of basic income. However, it won't happen by 2020-2022.
                    Last edited by Dipstick; 26-12-18, 01:28 AM.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Honestly there are a few of those wish list items that are farther away in another direction than reorganization, dissolution, or civil war. National 100% taxpayer subsidized liberal arts degrees in an economy that needed to wake up and smell vocational training and professional trades 20 years ago probably a big example. How is anybody helped by further devaluing a bachelor's degree at full taxpayer expense?
                      Your argument is exactly the argument used against high school before HS was accepted as necessary. I am big on trade schools, tech schools, and community colleges - that would be a great place to start. You get an educated taxpayer with a trade and far less chance of govt assistance needed later in life. Kids can no linger grow up and support themselves by work in the mills, or in the auto factory. Job requirements have changed. If we want our population to work and pay taxes then we have to give them a chance to get the skills they need. This country need to invest in infrastructure including helping citizens get through the current economic revolution.
                      Can we agree that the writers made everyone do and say everything with a thought to getting good ratings and being renewed. This includes everything we love as well as everything we hate.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Did the President of the United States of America really state publicly on t.v. that the Soviet Union was right to invade Afghanistan? Is he literally insane? Who is going to stop him? When? How? I can`t believe this is happening. I really can`t. It`s like a surreal nightmare.

                        flow
                        Last edited by flow; 09-01-19, 09:06 PM.
                        ................................ Banner by buffylover

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by flow View Post
                          Did the President of the United States of America really state publicly on t.v. that the Soviet Union was right to invade Afhanistan? Is he literally insane? Who is going to stop him? When? How? I can`t believe this is happening. I really can`t. It`s like a surreal nightmare.

                          flow
                          Who knows? I'm still laughing at this:

                          In an interview with Fox and Friends on Fox News Channel this morning, White House press secretary Sarah Sanders acknowledged that she was incorrect when she wrongly claimed that 4,000 terrorists had been stopped at the southern border of the United States. The correct number was six.

                          https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...test-news-live
                          sigpic

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Did the rest get through?

                            flow
                            ................................ Banner by buffylover

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by flow View Post
                              Did the rest get through?

                              flow
                              Sarah Sanders: “I should have said 4,000 at all points of entry, not just at the southern border."

                              I can see this being a very long wall!
                              sigpic

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X